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Notindebt · Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 7:02 pm Subject: CA contacted me, some questions

A somewhat questionable CA contacted me regarding a debt I supposedly owed. The CA is mentioned in another thread on this site as being a potential scammer/fraud. I'm pretty suspicious about this behavior. I've withheld/changed some information here just to further protect myself.

The CA contacted my parents last night. I haven't lived with my parents for several years (and they've moved twice since then). My parents were gracious enough to not give them my contact information. Not knowing that they were a CA, I called them back. They were polite enough on the phone, but sketchy/incorrect about many facts - they may have fabricated some of these details.

Essentially what it boils down to is that they claim I owe a debt on a mastercard that I took out in 2002 and made successful payments on from 2002 - Feb 2005. At that point, I supposedly stopped making payments. They provided the credit card number for me, and the amount that I allegedly owed ($1000 from a $650 original balance). At that point, I gave the CA a spammish email address that they could send the documents to. If the situation required further action on my part, I would go through traditional mail channels. The information they sent via email was scant at best - they sent me a flimsy looking affidavit of transfer from last October, and a balance due notice saying that I had until April 30, 2008 to pay off the debt.

Here are the facts that they got correct:
1) My name.
2) My SSN.

Here are the facts that they got wrong:
1) My address. Not only had I NEVER lived with my parents at their previous two addresses, I had not lived at the address they had on file for me in over 10 years - well before any of this alleged debt would have occurred.

2) The balance due. They claimed that the balance at the time of collection was $650. With 5.00% interest (that they claimed), in order to reach $1000 it would take well over 6 years to accrue. They made no mention of any additional fees tacked on, so it should just be pure debt + interest.

3) My credit account. I DO have an account with that creditor. Its in good standing. I pulled my annual credit reports for good measure and discovered that ALL my accounts are in good standing. Including two PREVIOUS accounts that I had on file for this particular creditor - which were started well before 2002. No accounts on my credit report were listed as being in the collections process.

Now, I can't promise that this wasn't a debt I didn't owe, but I am suspicious. The original creditor has NEVER made any attempts to contact me regarding this debt even though they have my address and SSN on file for other accounts. On the other hand, I was financially reckless in college and made some bad decisions with credit cards. I'm financially stable now, but a decade ago I certainly wasn't, so it could be that the debt would have been valid against the previous debtor.

They haven't made any additional attempts to contact me, yet. Any tips on what I should do when/if they attempt to contact me again? They threatened to take me to court if I disputed the claim.

Guest · Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 9:12 pm Subject:

It would be best to note the name of the company so people here have a better understanding of who you are dealing with. I am having a problem with a company also and the timeline is almost the same as yours. It would also be nice if you could tell us what state you live in as the statue of limitations could have expired and if it has, they can't sue you on it.
Have you got any letters from them?

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:04 am Subject:

Hit them with a debt validation letter immediately. There's a good template here. Be sure to print off the enclosure [FTC opinion letter] and include it with the letter. Send the whole thing certified mail, return receipt requested, so you can prove they got it.

Next, give me a little more info, if you please. Who is the collection agency you're dealing with, what state do you live in, and when was the last time you actually made a payment on this? With that info, we can be of more assistance.

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:28 am Subject:

They threatened to sue you if you disputed it? That's overshadowing at it's finest. When you dispute a debt (requesting validation as UncleWulf suggested, which I agree you should do) you are requesting documentation that shows that 1. You owe the debt, 2. They own/manage the account, and 3. They are legally capable of collecting it.

It all falls under basic contract law, now if they try to pressure you into action before you can request validation then it is considered overshadowing, which is a violation of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act.

Telling you that they will file suit if you dispute it is overshadowing at it's worst. They've already given you grounds to file suit against them for at least $1,000.

Notindebt · Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 1:32 pm Subject:

Thanks for the help and quick replies! Sorry for the vagueness - I'm trying to cover myself in case they come snooping around this forum. I know they're mostly powerless to do anything with regards to what I post here, but it never hurts to be too careful.

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 2:00 pm Subject:

I would say that there is a good chance that if it's not on your credit report (meaning the 7 years +180 day reporting period has expired) then it's well past SOL for your state. Request validation and if they threaten suit tell them to go smoke a pipe.

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 2:01 pm Subject:

It sounds to me like they have jack**** for validation anyway if they want to scare you that badly out of requesting validation.

Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 2:25 pm Subject:

to be honest, this sounds like a scam all the way. NO LEGITIMATE BUSINESS will tell you that you cannot dispute it without them suing you--federal law states that if you dispute it they MUST honor your dispute and provide you with proper validation of the debt. And I tend to think of this issue in this way--if they had the legal right to collect the debt, if it is a real debt, and if they have the documentation needed to prove their case, then they wouldnt have any reason to try to bully you into not using your rights.

At this point I would do three things, in this order--

1--contact the original creditor that they claim this account was with. Tell them what is happening, and ask them to confirm the information you were given about this account. If it is a real account they will be able to tell you, unless they sold it off to some debt collector. This would be my first move--if they have this account, but show it to be in good standing and not having this past due balance, then ask them to send you a written statement confirming that the account(ask them to include the account # in the statement) is in good standing with no past due balance owed.

2--Send a certified letter to the CA you mentioned, not even requesting, but DEMANDING validation in accordance with section 809 of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act. As a general rule, if someone is this nasty to me, I cut to the chase and cut the crap in a hurry. They flat-out lied to you, it was illegal to do so in any case, and they are breaking the law by trying to force you into giving up your legal rights--DONT. I would even go as far as to state in this letter that you were told over the phone on (date) that you would be sued if you disputed the debt, and welcome them to file that lawsuit. One of three things will happen--either they will suddenly shut up because they will see that you know the law and your rights, they will continue to act like idiots, or they will want to all of a sudden play nice-nice.

You will want to send that letter certified mail, return receipt requested, so you can prove that it was sent and received. If you have a letter from (1) above, the statement from the original creditor, then send them a copy in this letter.

3--contact your state's attorney general's office and file a formal complaint against these morons for their actions. What they did was 100% illegal, even if this is a real debt. Again, if you got a statement from the OC, you can fax it to the AG's office. They typically take a good deal of interest in a business that's illegally trying to collect on debts, especially fake debts.

Guest · Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 2:43 pm Subject:

Small update:

I spoke with the CA today. I told them I had reviewed the information that they provided to me and did not believe that the debt was mine. They then told me if that was the case that they would be taking me to court. Specifically, they told me that they would be filing in the county courthouse. I asked them which county and they told me they weren't sure, since they don't yet have my address.

I asked them if they had any additional paperwork to provide me regarding the loan and they told me no. I then asked them how they arrived at the dates for the last transactions and they told me that they were given those as part of the debt package when they bought the debt. I then notified them that I would be mailing them a debt validation letter by the end of the week. I'm hesitant to do this mainly because I don't want them to obtain my address, but I suppose it doesn't matter because they can get it in the end.

They haven't given me the documentation that gives me my rights to dispute the debt. I read on here somewhere that that was required to be given within 5 days of the initial contact (Thursday). Could somebody clarify?

Here are the two documents that I received last Thursday from them. I've starred out any confidential portions:

Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 3:00 pm Subject:

Did you send a DV letter yet? It is very important that you do as the others have suggested. Yes the CA will be getting your mailing address but it will give you a paper trail for your records. It will also serve to put them in their palace….show them that you are educated on your rights.

Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 3:25 pm Subject:

If that is the only thing that they have for validation they won't have a leg to stand on in court. Affidavits may be sworn statements however in court they are hearsay without the person which completed it to testify to it's accuracy/validity.

Notindebt · Posted: Mon Apr 14, 2008 4:12 pm Subject:

Thanks for the support. I mailed out the validation letter just now, certified with return receipt. The USPS was open late thanks to tax season Wink

Posted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:05 am Subject:

Thats Great Notindebt
Now just wait and see what they come up with. Smile

Notindebt · Posted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:35 am Subject:

I'm very proactive right now about trying to get as much information about this company as I can. My parents helped me discover that the website has been largely copied wholesale from other websites word-for-word.

The address (1900 Empire Blvd, Webster, NY) appears to reference a strip mall in that city. There IS a salon there, so I suppose its a possibility that this CA is run out of the salon. It would be a trend!

Again, thanks for everyone's help. If you have any information regarding this so-called company, I would be glad to hear about it!

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