Internet's first get-out-of-debt community - 123,000 members

Old School Collector · Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:46 pm Subject: Bad Advice

I have been reading your board and have a few thoughts.

1. I have seen several times your moderators advise people to not pay bills or go after the collector. Why do you think not paying a debt helps someone fix bad credit and why do you think sending a c-d letter helps when all that is going to do is force the creditor to sue or resell the paper.

2. Why do you not advise of the legal consequences of non payment. I am not talking crazy threats but legit consequences like wage garnishments, tax withholding, bad credit, judgements and liens. If the debtor is a property owner and does not pay a bill they can face a high intrest lien on there property that has to be satisfied at the time of sale or refiance why put somebody in that position over a credit card they may be able to settle out or save on.

3. Why do you attempt to creat and atmosphere or victimization to justify ways not to pay bills why no give solid advise that can help people get out of debt instead of making the situation worse?

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:56 pm Subject:

Ok, here we go....

I don't know who is advising anyone NOT to pay their bills. I don't, and I know the majority of the moderators here don't do that, either.

What we WILL do, however, is advise a consumer to obtain validation of their debt prior to paying it. This is not debt avoidance, nor is it a stall tactic. It's simply a good idea. Even in this day of technological advances, mistakes are made, and a consumer being pursued by a debt collector may not be the one who actually owes the debt. Also, the technological advances we have made have made it easier for the crooks out there to steal our identities. Therefore, debt validation is simply a good idea.

If you take time to look at many of the posts titled "will I get sued", or "can they take me to court", or "can they garnish my wages" - you will find that we DO advise people of what can happen to them if a creditor sues them for default. They CAN be taken to court and their wages CAN be garnished. We all know that, and we advise newcomers to the site of that very fact. I'm not sure where you're seeing otherwise.

We do give solid advice, based on the laws of each consumer's state. A C&D Letter is only advised when a collection agency is harrassing a consumer. And we never tell a consumer that sending a C&D Letter will prevent them from having to pay a debt.

I'm not sure how long you've been reading our board, but I don't think it's been long, or you would have seen the good advice we provide. If we weren't providing solid advice that helps people get out of debt - by legal means - then we wouldn't still be here, still be growing in number of members, and the site would simply cease to exist. And you definitely wouldn't see people coming back to post things like "thank you! I'm so grateful I found this site!"

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:08 pm Subject:

I've never been told NOT to pay my bill from this forum! But what is being told is to see for yourself how a 4,000 debt can suddenly be 9,400 and now 12,500 in a year and a half! It didn't make sense to me "before" i even found this site and it still doesn't! Reminds me of loan sharks!
Hey! That might have been a better idea, to go to a loan shark than deal with this! Probably wouldn't have such an inflated debt!
I've ALWAYS wanted to pay my debt back, what i rightfully owe, this is!
So, I guess we ALL read things differently cuz i've NEVER EVER seen someone say, DO NOT PAY UR BILLS! (kinda wish there WAS a way! but don't we all?)
Ang

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:10 pm Subject:

I'm not sure where people get the idea that everyone is saying "don't pay your bills" far from it. Only that everything is in order first. I know from experience if you don't validate you can get burned. I paid off one debt twice to two companies! I didn't realize it until afterwards, but I didn't know any better and I was in such a hurry to try and pay my debts I didn't keep good track of them. If I had found this site earlier I wouldn't have made that mistake. So yeah people need to know the debt is legit first.

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 3:35 pm Subject:

It's very interesting to me that most of the collectors who post on the boards all say we tell people not to pay their bills. How does asking for debt validation, which is a right under the FDCPA, mean not paying your bills? If the debt is yours, then you have an obligation to pay it.
And as can be seen from many of the posts here, not every debt collectors call on are legitamately owed by the person on the other end of the phone. The burden of proof is on the collector.
If the debtor does indeed owe the debt, then they have to work with the collector to make payment arrangements that both can live with.
What does not need to happen is the harassment that many of our members live with on a daily basis--especially those of us who are dealing with PDL's. I am much more willing to work with a collector who is professional on the phone and not lying, saying that I will be arrested, my children will be taken away and calling my boss to say I am quitting--all things that have happened to the members on the boards. That is uncalled for.

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:12 pm Subject:

WEll KS I suspect thats because the more people who become educated about their RIGHTS, the less money collectors make. I mean honestly, until i came here, if a collector called, I just paid it off. It never dawned on me that hey, this may not be my bill!

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:15 pm Subject:

I had a situation where 2 DIFFERENT CA's were attempting to collect on the SAME debt. What did I do? I paid the original creditor. If I had not known my rights, I would've paid the same debt TWICE to two different CA's. And nobody tells people on the forum not to pay their debts.

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:16 pm Subject:

Scratch that, with the exception of Bass and Associates.

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:24 pm Subject:

And what's really fascinating to me is that the only people who ever say that about us are collectors! It must be because they are threatened that we are educating people about their rights, and never have said just blow the debt off if it's really owed.

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:30 pm Subject:

I agree with what has been said in the responses to the old school collector. I don't encourage not to pay their bills. Although, it seems that we get accused of that from time to time. This is simply not true. We do encourage people to validate said debt if going through a collection agency. Like it's been said, it is their right under the FDCPA. I do encourage people to send a cease and desist if they are being constantly harassed by a certain debt collector. I have made arrangments with the orginal creditors and just paid off two. I'm not going to deal with someone who is going to threaten me on the first call with arrest, fraud, etc. That is against the law and a collector should know better. Unfortunately, too many people fall victim to this kind of tactic. I know there are good collectors out because I have dealt with them. I've been able to make payment arrangements with them with no trouble. I guess you could say it's a two way street but don't accuse us of something that we are not doing.

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:10 pm Subject:

Old school debt collector i think you are confused
And you dont know the difference of the bad and
Good here.
Please read this in the washington post and if my
English is not good please give me a break...
Debt consolidation care forum members are wonderful
People and give me a break again!!!
(Http://blog.washingtonpost.com/thecheckout/2006/07/debt_collectors_th e_good_the_b.html)

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:15 pm Subject:

Debt consolidation care members always tell people to
Pay their bills and you have not a right mister old
School to came here and harassed my guardian angels
And the guardian angels of many people in this forum.
Please mister old school give me a break!!!

oldschoolcollectors enemy · Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 12:00 am Subject:

I am going to say it.

Do not pay any Junk Debt Buyer a huge amount for a small charged off balance, they bought for pennies on the dollar. They rip you off by adding extreme fees and interest.

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 12:18 am Subject:

You're very right about that oldschoolcollector. junk debt is nothing but extortion. I disagree with some of your original post though. Indeed I would advise not to pay unsecured debt before putting rent, food, mortgage payments, etc. first. Persons in this situation might already have "bad credit" and non-payment wouldn't matter much. Not all states allow for garnishment, etc. and in some states there's little a creditor can do even with a judgment. I'm not out to immediately go after a collector for the odd violation, but there are many well known companies who routinely and knowingly violate the law, and I would advise to go after them to the fullest extent. Consumers have rights, and do not have to deal with lying, extortion, fraud, and various other criminal acts, whether the consumer has bills or not. I understand your post, but sometimes, bad times fall on good people. Thanks for posting here.

Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 2:58 am Subject:

wow, what is it with you collectors? Do you travel in packs or something? Each time we have one joker show up in here spouting off bad information and dishonesty, along comes another one....

Look, I am all for people paying their bills, but lets you and me get one thing straight right now, so there will be no confusion about it later--

IF YOU, AS A COLLECTOR, BREAK THE LAW WHILE CALLING ME, YOU WILL BE HELD LIABLE IN COURT FOR THE MAXIMUM POSSIBLE AMOUNT.

Now, since you collectors seem to think that the FDCPA is a professional sports association or something, perhaps you should get an education about your chosen industry before going any further. If I owe a $500 debt, and you commit 20 different violations of the FDCPA trying to collect it, I WILL be taking your back side to court, and I WILL win. And when I do, YOU will be footing the bill for that $500 debt yourself....and the remainder of the money you are ordered to pay will be sent to me. Is it really worth you people constantly ignoring the law? Try me....and find out for yourself. Out of everyone here, I am probably the single last person you had better hope to come across in your work. Because I know the law where far too many of your contemporaries do not. And that law works for me. I have had more than one debt on my credit files that was not mine...and believe me, I know how to handle that. So go ahead, call away. In the short time I have been here, I have seen collectors come and go from this place. One of the latest ones was a guy that claimed he could legally call my house all day long if he felt like it....who cares that the federal law says otherwise, right?

Bottom line----it used to be that consumers had to watch out for you collectors....now, that has changed. Now, YOU had better be the one on your game. YOU had better be the educated one. YOU had better make sure you know the law and follow it. Because I dont care--if it really is my debt or not, if it is a big debt or not, I dont care. I will only deal with people who have a clue and dont think that they have the right to screw with people just because they are working for XYZ collections. It's your turn to have to watch how you handle yourself....because we aint puttin up with the crap anymore. The phone calls are being recorded. The letters are being sent. Records are being kept. And it WILL bite you in the a$$...count on it.

With all that said, if you are among the minority in collections(that means if you are honest and actually interested in helping people the legal way), then by all means, you are welcome here. But if you are just going to skip around the truth, avoid the questions, and lie about the law, then please just head on back the way you came, as we already have too many like that in here. I am not looking for a war, but if trouble wants me, thats cool too.

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