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 Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 11:31 am Subject: Secured or unsecured debt? |
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Hi again, I have another question:
WHat exactly is considered secured debt? I applied for a Kays Jewelers card a while ago and used it about 6 months later to purchase an engagement ring. Shortly after a proposed, I lost my job and have been unable to make payments. This account is now about a year overdue and I am starting to get enough cash to pay it off.
Would this be considered a secured or unsecured debt?
Im worried about them trying to take my wifes ring away from her if I dont have the funds in time to pay it back.
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Dasboot
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| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 2:13 pm Subject: |
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Credit cards are considered unsecured.
Secured would be a mortgage or auto loan.
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desperatelyseekingsanity
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| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 2:13 pm Subject: |
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I sincerely doubt that they are going to come and take your wife's ring back. I would contact them and try to work something out. More than likely they will sue you.
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ladybug
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| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 2:55 pm Subject: |
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Heck no, if they tried to get my ring, or my gal's ring, I would say "oops, I lost it"
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markofkane
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| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:14 pm Subject: |
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The store cards work a little differently than traditional credit cards. With store cards, very often, they are actually secured by the goods you buy at that store. If you read the receipt on a store card, it acts as a conditional sales contract. They retain a purchase-money security interest in the goods until paid for.
Granted they probably won't come knocking on your door to ask for a ring back. But they could go to court for a replevin order, and a judge would tell you to give the ring back. (As MoK suggests ... What if you say you lost it? -- well I don't know, but if you lie under oath and they can prove it then you can go to jail for perjury.
Even if they can, they probably won't try to get the ring back. They'd probably do like any other credit card and rather sell the account. If you have been saving up, just call them and see if they will settle something.
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DebtCruncher
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 8:56 am Subject: |
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Yeah, I've heard stories of Sears trying to get washers, etc. back!!
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desperatelyseekingsanity
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 8:58 am Subject: |
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When my ex's mother declared bankruptcy she had about 7 things she got on a Sears card. They told her to pay a reduced fee, like $400 for a $1,500 Television or give it back.
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:02 am Subject: |
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Even if didn't work? (insert evil smile here)
lol. Oops, the TV fell off the stand!!
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markofkane
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| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 11:20 am Subject: |
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Hey I just bought some drywall and a toilet on my Lowes card. I wonder if they would sue me for the materials back if I didn't pay it. Hehe. I really doubt they would attach the ring if it ever went to court unless the ring was really really expensive like 100k expensive. I suspect it would take the same path that any other credit card would take. If you have the money I would try to settle the debt and be done with it.
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DOLLARSandSINCE
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| Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:16 am Subject: |
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Sears is bad about trying to recover items, they tried to repo my lawn mower after the debt was discharged in BK
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| Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 4:40 am Subject: |
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A lot of times when you go bankrupt, if they do have a valid security interest, they will try to get you to reaffirm or give back the merchandise. Kind of their way of having the last word.
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DebtCruncher
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| Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 6:51 am Subject: |
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I believe they (Sears) should've tried to recover the merchandise BEFORE the BK discharge. If they tried to recover items AFTER a BK discharge, isn't that breaking the law?
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desperatelyseekingsanity
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| Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:36 am Subject: |
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Sears is a little different now. A few years ago Sears sold off their Charge Card unit to Citibank. So now its basically a Sears branded Citibank charge account. Ultimately, It would be Citibank's decision on how they would proceed.
As to the original poster, this is from the terms and conditions you agreed to when you opened up the account:
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11. Security Interest: Except in CT, MO (on any purchase under $150.00), and NY (on any purchase under $200.00), where we do not retain any security interest, you grant us a purchase money security interest in each item of merchandise purchased on your Account to secure its unpaid purchase price until such item of merchandise is paid for in full (in NY, not to exceed five (5) years from date the purchase is posted to your Account). Solely for the purpose of determining the extent of our purchase money security interest in each such item of merchandise, your payments will be allocated first to any unpaid insurance premium, next to any unpaid Late Fees, any unpaid Returned Check Fees and any unpaid Finance Charge, then to pay off each purchase in the order in which the purchase was made. For the purpose of determining the amount owing on your Account, payments will be credited as explained in the "Minimum Monthly Payment" paragraph above.
12. Default/Collection Costs: If you fail to pay any minimum monthly payment when due, or if the prospect of payment, performance, or realization of collateral is significantly impaired, to the extent permitted by applicable law it will be a default, and, subject to any right you may have under state law to receive notice of and to cure such default, we may declare the entire unpaid balance on the Account due and payable (except in WI you will not be in default until you fail to make a minimum payment on two occasions within a twelve (12) month period). We may also repossess any article of merchandise in which we still retain a security interest, but we will do so only in the manner and to the extent permitted by applicable law. If the Account is referred to an attorney who is not our salaried employee and we bring a suit against you to collect the amount you owe, in addition to the full amount owed and any court costs, you agree to pay our reasonable attorney's fees of 15% of the total amount due (10% of any amount due in AR, 10% of any amount due over $500.00 in NJ, and 10% of any amount due of $3,800.00 or less in OK), or such lesser amount as may be permitted by applicable law. No attorney's fees will be imposed in AL (when the unpaid balance is under $300.00), DC, IA, KS, ME, NE, OH, SD, WV, and WI, or in any state, or in any amount, where not permitted by law. In the states of CA, CT, DE, NH, and PA, we will pay your reasonable attorney's fees if you prevail in a suit we bring against you or if you prevail in a suit you bring against us under this Agreement. Notice to New Hampshire Residents: If you successfully assert a partial defense or counterclaim, the court may withhold part or all of any attorney's fees to which we may be entitled.
13. Canceling or Limiting Your Credit/Credit Cards: We have the right at any time to limit or terminate the use of your Account and raise or lower your credit limit without giving you notice in advance. Some purchases will require our prior authorization, in which case you may be asked to provide identification. If our authorization system is not working, we may not be able to authorize a transaction, even if you have sufficient available credit. We will not be liable to you if this happens. We are not responsible for the refusal of anyone to accept or honor a credit card. All credit cards we issue remain our property and, if requested, you agree to return any credit card issued to you. You agree to notify us promptly if any credit card we issue to you is lost or stolen. In addition, even if you cancel the use of your Account or a credit card by an authorized user, you are still responsible for any Account balances incurred by the authorized user that remain unpaid. Your credit limit with us may be reduced by the amount of credit purchases you make at other retail jewelers that are affiliated with us. To request the names of the other retail jewelers that are affiliated with us, please call our Credit Customer Service Department at 1-800-877-3616 or 1-330-668-5000, Ext. 6867. You may request an increase in your credit line at any time by writing to us at P.O. Box 3680, Akron, OH 44309-3680 or calling us at the number included on your monthly statements for such inquiries |
You can view these terms and conditions in their entirety on Kay Jewelers website . It looks like Kay Jewelers does their own financing. I don't know if that makes them more or less likely to work with you to resolve the account.
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Last edited by LCW on Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:40 am |
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LCW
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| Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:39 am Subject: |
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No...it's like filing BK with a mortgage--the debt can be wiped, but that doesn't mean the debtor owns it.
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Morningstar
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| Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:40 am Subject: |
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Don't they have to petition thru the courts to get the merchandise back?
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desperatelyseekingsanity
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