Bodog, and Joseph Mann and Creed

after a death in the family, Playing Bodog I went nuts gambling and after the smoke cleared had lost $1111 on my wifes Visa card. A few days later all the charges appeared as Australian "phone company" charges. I disputed them all and won. Now Bodog contacted me threatening to send to JMC collections and ruin my wifes credit. I am devastated even more now, I cannot screw up her score. Additionally even though I was not listed on her account they say they are sending my name to collections as well. I am very familiar with disputing errors on credit reports and how to deal with these collectors, so I am just waiting for my 1st letter from them. Then I will deny is is legit and ask for validation of debt. My next step would be to check our credit reports and see if they are on there, then dispute? My question is what are the chances of this not ending up on our credit given the facts that. They are international company, used wrong merchant coding to allow CC. Charges were disputed in my favor from CC company, and they do not have our SS #..thanks!

Is gambling legal in your state? Also with you using your wife's CC yet the debt generated by yourself it's kinda sketchy. Someone with more experience should be along shortly.

The first question is if you read the agreement in full, that could pose some issues. If this is an overseas operation, you could have inadvertantly agreed to giving them the right to open a separate account if the credit card company declines or finds in your favor in a dispute of charges. This is kind of dicey, as the electronic paper you signed could be found to be legitimate in a state court.


Please post more information, this all depends on the jurisdiction the site runs out of.

guest, listen to hockeyman's advice. He is very knowledgable in the field of law.

I dont think this will go to court, I am more worried about the credit report. They are a shady online gambling site who changes thier merchant code to a 3rd party "phhone/cable" to accept visa. Also odd how they started out for my wife, then said they will send both files for collection. Here is the emails below:
Dear Customer (Account: XXx-$1111.00),
If you wish to settle your account, contact us in 24 hours. If not, both of your files will be sent off to the firm and you can consider our correspondence as finished.


Regards,


Magnus
Accounts Department
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--- Original Message ---
From:XXXXX
Received: 12/6/07 1:13:47 PM PST
To: Magnus - Bodog Collections Service <magnus>
Subject: Re: XXX XXX - Please Call

Chris XXXX is not associated with my account or the charges in question.

Magnus - Bodog Collections Service <magnus> wrote: Dear Customer (AccountXXXX-$1111.00),We have many descriptors, such as M-TLTD.com, that are used to protect your privacy. Telling your credit card company that the charges were fraudulent does not absolve you of your responsibility. You are still being held accountable for the debt.

We will pursue this issue until it is resolved. Understandably, it would not be difficult to hire a 3rd party collections firm on US soil to perform derogatory credit reporting.

Since it is evident that you have no intention to resolve this issue, you can expect a letter from the firm shortly. Both yourself and Chris XXXX will be referred.Magnus
Accounts Department
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--- Original Message ---
From: XXX
Received: 12/6/07 12:22:20 PM PST
To: Magnus - Bodog Collections Service <magnus>
Subject: Re: XXXXXXX - Please Call

I was only speculating as to what may have happened, as I said the charges from your "phone company" were fraudulent. Aditionally American law on Internet gambling is extremely strict: You cannot collect on a debt that was caused directly by gambling on a international Internet gambling site. If you go onto my credit report, I will simply and easily dispute and remove it as you have no basis.

Magnus - Bodog Collections Service <magnus> wrote: Dear Customer (Account: XXXX-$1111.00),Please review our Player Agreement again. Our software and website do not record any of your personal information, that would understandably be a security risk. The CVV2 number has to be entered each time you make a deposit, which is not recorded anywhere except the back of your card. We suggest that you file a police report, and may we remind you that filing a false claim is an indictable offense.

As per Sec. 14 of our Player Agreement: "Player accepts all responsibility for any wager placed from Player's confidential account whether placed by Player or not, provided the correct Account Number and Password are received by Bodog. Specifically, the Player accepts all responsibility for any transactions placed on their Account by anyone else that received the confidential login information from the Player, whether voluntarily or otherwise."

Your account is being held here until December 13, 2007. If this matter is not resolved on or before this date, your file will be referred to 3rd party credit collections. This will affect your credit standing.
Magnus
Accounts Department
===================================


--- Original Message ---
From: XXX
Received: 12/6/07 11:57:56 AM PST
To: Magnus - Bodog Collections Service <magnus>
Subject: Re: XXXXX - Please Call



Magnus,

Someone logged onto my account and used my card information. I did not authorize the charge or play. I had not played on your site for months, Bodog stored the personal information making it very easy for unauthorized use. If you send to collections I understand. I will dispute that as well with Equifax and Transunion. I have the documentation from my credit card company supporting my claim.

If you would like to discuss settlement arangements please let me know, thanks.

Magnus - Bodog Collections Service <magnus> wrote:
Dear XXXXX (Account: XXX-$1111.00),Re: Outstanding Balance: $1111.00

After further review of your account with our Security Department, the transactions on the account do not show any activities consistent with fraud. It would be quite unlikely for someone to have set up an account under your name, from which only you would benefit.

Payouts are only made payable to the customer's their name and not through their financial institution.

The transaction history of your E-cash statement shows usage of a credit card, as the CVV2 number was provided, since April 8, 2007.

As per Sec. 14 of our Player Agreement: "Player accepts all responsibility for any wager placed from Player's confidential account whether placed by Player or not, provided the correct Account Number and Password are received by Bodog. Specifically, the Player accepts all responsibility for any transactions placed on their Account by anyone else that received the confidential login information from the Player, whether voluntarily or otherwise."

Your account is being held here until December 13, 2007. If this matter is not resolved on or before this date, your file will be referred to 3rd party credit collections.

Govern yourself accordingly.
Magnus
Accounts Department
===================================



--- Original Message ---
From: XXXX
Received: 12/6/07 11:22:43 AM PST
To: Magnus M <magnus>
Subject: Re: XXXXX - Please Call

My credit card was charged fraudulently.

Magnus M <magnus> wrote: Dear Danielle Galati (Account: 1743142-$1111.00),Your file has been transferred to my office for 3rd party credit reporting from our Security Department for rejected credit/debit card transaction(s).

You need to call our office immediately to avoid derogatory credit reporting to Equifax and Trans Union.

jmc will not ruin your wife's credit( PLEASE PROCEED WITH LAWSUIT IF THEY ACTUALLY DO )JMC only makes threats to do so--dispute--dispute--dispute--they can't provide proof! contact ftc with complaint--contact credit reporting agencies with notice of fraud against JMC and company they are representing who processed--tell them names and dollar amount you dispute and let them know you have disputed all charges and that company hasn't provided proper validation--!!!-- someone is trying to collect on charges reported other than what were actually made?--jmc won't provide any validation--they can't--they will most likely make up a name of some third party processor you owe the money to--also report them to the Ohio BBB and contact your state attorney general with a complaint--also JcMET I don't think it matters if gambling is legal in your state--because on-line internet gambling transactions are illegal here in U.S. and anyone who processes those transactions is the one who gets burned if people choose not to honor this debt. Problem is these companies break law processing transactions and don't give a hoot about validating anything--just turn it into companies like JMC when you don't pay--- to do the dirty work for them--9 months ago JMC contacted me with threats on internet gambling debts I did not make and were indeed actual fraud--told me I should just "fess up" and pay--nope I didn't wouldn't and won't-- would have been easy thing to do--just pay money to make them go away--but instead after seeing how they treated me--will spend my spare time trying to get someone in senate or congress to investigate and go after them --these tactic's they use are horrendous and the threats of ruining your credit are means for class action lawsuits if enough people will simply join hands and proceed--don't be afraid of these liars it is a waste of time --dispute with all mentioned suggestions above--move on and by all means stop gambling it is a no win situation because even if you win you will never know when to walk away!

Every time you go to that site and make a transaction, think of it as though you are stepping on their soil and buying something.

There is a firm misconception among most consumers about internet gambling. While these sites are illegal and these debts are uncollectable while the site is OPERATING ON UNITED STATES SOIL, the debts can magically come to life if the debts were incurred while OPERATING ON FOREIGN SOIL where this type of practice is legal. Why do you think that congress did its best to try and stamp out activity of the foreign sites?

Even when internet gambling, you are exposing yourself to potential liability. Don't even get me started on what venues you could be sued in.

They are not going to sue me for $1111, even the owner of Bodog, Calvin Ayres is not allowed to step foot in the US, he will be arrested. They just said they will turn it over to collections, from my early research will be JMC, I also sent them the following email:
One more thing,

Should I hear from a collector regarding this I will be sure to notify Visa and Mastercard of the fraudulent merchant coding that your site is using. As evidenced in prior email from you:

Dear Customer (Account:XXXXXX-$1111.00),We have many descriptors, such as M-TLTD.com, that are used to protect your privacy

I am sure they would welcome evidece that you are using incorrect phone/cable coding to accept illegal gambling charges.

Oh, I had already looked into the Ohio BBB, and guess what..JMC is no longer a member, they are rated unsatisfactory.

Well that's the part i don't get... how can they change the charge code and be legal?? U recieved NO phone or cable services from these people, right? Doesn't seem legit to me, of course, i'm NO atty.
Ang

Correct, I received no phone/cable services. They use a 3rd party to be able to accept credit card payments. For example, you sign up on Bodog to gamble, put in your credit card, get the cash in your Bodog account..then the charges show up as some other company Phone/Cable. They have to change the Merchant coding otherwise the charge would be declined. I do think this is illegal and I threatened to bring this to Visa/MC attention with all documentation. The main thing is I am worried about my Wife's credit report.

Welcome to the United States of America, where anyone can sue anyone; great country isn't it.

At this time, I will issue the letter I send to clients of whom I do not find them or their insureds as satisfactory to handle the cases.

At this time, I am discontinuing any and all relationship that may or may not have been implied over the court of communications. At no time have I provided you with any official legal advice, any and all communications have been investigative. I wish to notify you that with any and all actions involving a foreign entity, you should consult an attorney as soon as possible because, depending upon jurisdiction and treaties in enforcement, it is quite possible for that foreign entity to prevail in a proceeding in a foreign court and seek relief of enforcement in federal court, no matter what the activity initially sought was. Thank you for your time and consideration in this matter.

hockeyman if there is a firm misconception about internet gambling-why was u.s unlawful internet gambling act passed?--why are companies breaking the law if they process--why did companies like Neteller belly-up?--the debts might magically come to life if you travel to the Island of Mann of wherever they are operating from--but from what I have seen--on-line internet gambling debts are illegal and uncollectable here in the U.S.--can you cite cases where people in U.S. actually received judgements and had to pay hockeyman? I have searched and searched and could not find any. All I have been able to find are complaints about this company

.

They change their name and list it as things like an Australian Telecom company because the United States Government has passed several laws and regulations making it illegal to accept credit cards for on line gaming, EVEN IF THE OPERATION IS BASED OUT SIDE THE US. Those same laws also make it illegal for consumer to use credit cards for gaming. Those laws were enacted for the very reason you have described.

There is probably a very good chance this will eventually end up on your and or your wifes credit reports, and you will have to dispute them. Keep all documentation from the credit card issuer to support that process.

That having been said, you did incurr this debt, and you need to resolve it. While the legality of the debt is questionable, there remains a ethical issue. When their collections agent contacts you, you would probably be better off tryng to arrange a settlement and re-payment plan ( say $100 month if you can afford it). Check your state laws. Many states do not allow colelction agencies to pass their charges and any additional interest or fees on to the consumers they are collecting from. Therefore once the debt passes to a collection agency, the amount they can collect on is frozen at the balance on the day the collection agency aquired the debt.

I know this sight encourages all 2 pay- i think u should not pay

I am a compulsive gambler...I incurred charges on my credit card, bank accounts etc. However I never lied to cover up my the charges...I paid them and my family knew it. Guest...I am not saying you have a habit...just face up to what you did..pay it and don't keep it from your wife. Honesty is the best policy.