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Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 9:37 am Subject: experiences with asking for validation

okay, I asked this before but didn't get much of a response. I got to thinking about it again and thought it to be interesting conversation.

Has anyone here, ever actually got full validation from a collection agency once asked?

I have asked for it on a few accounts. One agency wrote back and said that they're working on it and it could take up to 90 days. --okay, guess thats something--

Another, Encore, has ignored me thus far. Not another word out of them once I asked for it but yet original creditor tells me to talk to encore. yeah, that would be me chasing my tail.

THen another agency I asked for validation from, called their version of validation, a copy of the last six payments made on the accounts. (they're holding two accounts). Its Oxford and since sending their 'validation', they call every day after being told not to. Is what they sent legal? could they be thinking they sent validation and I'm thinking they didn't...who's right? Its definitely not what I asked for, copy of last six payments. That just validates that I made the last six payments..lol and it proves that its mine. Is that all the courts need to sue me?
I was told the ball is in their part now but I'm sure they're thinking its in mine. should I write them back and point out that this isn't what I asked for? I was told here in the group, not to ask for it again, to leave it be. opinions please.

okay--so I'm curious to hear everyone elses experiences with asking for validation.
Shirley

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:57 am Subject:

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 2:45 pm Subject:

Suddenly one plan struck in my mind. Why don't you write this statement while sending your payment?

Once you accept my payment, check #......., you have to report the account #........ as �Paid� to the credit bureaus.

Can a consumer add this comment while paying bills? I have read somewhere in this forum or anywhere else, that one person wrote �final payment� on the back of the check and when creditor cashed the check, they considered it to be the last payment. Any comment?

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 3:44 pm Subject:

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 4:32 pm Subject:

Shirley,

You're a very good consumer, willing to pay your bills. You will never be in trouble because your intention has been noble and if anyone brings legal actions against you, I think the judge will obviously understand the reality, so don't worry.

I cannot remember the exact place, but I read somewhere on the net, that if CA verifies an account with credit bureau but doesn't respond to validation, it is considered as a violation of fdcpa. You might like to consult a lawyer with this.

I know you have tried all the possible avenues to get it solved. However, consider another thing. Contact credit bureau and tell them that CA did not send validation to you but verified the account with bureau. Hope this time you will get this entry removed. Another thing I will say here, before sending your letter to bureau, try to speak to call credit bureaus and see what they recommend.

Can you remember the SOL for all of these accounts? Perhaps you know the SOL issues well. Just tried to remind you�

Please inform us if you get any positive response by calling credit bureau.

Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 5:08 pm Subject:

I agree that this is a violation and you should file a complaint with the FTC. Maybe then they might cooperate? I don't know. I wish you luck.

I send out demand for verification letters routinely for clients, and occasionally for myself. I've probably sent hundreds. I've gotten exactly two responses, both from a law firm in Richmond, Va. regarding a client's purported Citicorp [url=http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/credit-card.html]credit card debt[/url]. In each case they sent about an inch and a half thick stack of paper containing exactly nothing of any legal significance. I don't think the creditors keep the paper, or even images of the paper. That's why they can never respond to the demand for verification. And the mere fact that they send paper back doesn't make the paper a valid response - they have to show you their evidence they could use in court to prove that (1) there is an outstanding valid debt and (2) that you're the person who contracted the debt. If the paper doesn't do that, it's not a response.

Posted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 9:24 am Subject:

So if a collection agency sends improper documentation in response to DV, what should the debtors do next? Should they send another DV stating that the earlier one fail to provide the expected information? Or consumers can stop payment since the debt was not validated at all.

I treat a bad response as no response. It's just as if they hadn't sent anything at all; they can't take any action to collect, etc.

I do send them a letter telling them that the response was deficient. Here's an example of a recent one. The deficiencies will vary with the facts and circumstances of each case (so this can't be used as a "form letter"), so one will have to look at the response with an eye to the requirements for a sufficient evidentiary production.

The point of the letter is to be able to prove later that you put them on notice of the deficiency. You can never have too much evidence, and most folks wait until they're actually in litigation before they start thinking of preparing evidence.

-----
I am in receipt of about one and one-half inches of papers you sent me, purportedly in response to [client name]'s verification for demand pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act.

I have reviewed the documentation you supplied, and I find that it is deficient in several important ways. The entities to whom the money appears to be owed is not the same as the creditor named. But there is no documentation to show exactly how and why the entity you represent should be paid for debts purportedly incurred to others, or to show that [client name] was properly placed on notice
of any sale or assignment of assets. As you are no doubt aware, in Virginia, one can only be required to pay a third party if given notice by the original creditor of the terms of any transfer of the debt, since one pays a third-party at the risk of the original creditor's claims for nonpayment.

Secondly, I find nothing purporting to be signed by [client name] agreeing to any terms or conditions or basis for the imposition of interest. There is no evidence of compliance with Regulation Z. No documentation of offer and acceptance. In short, no basis for the imposition of liability other than someone's having identified [client name] as a debtor.

I do not believe you have complied with [client name]'s demand for verification, since there is nothing in the pile of paper you provided that overcomes his denial of the indebtedness to the party you identified.

[client name] reasserts his demand for verification and objects to your attempts to contact him by telephone, having actual knowledge of the fact that he is represented by an attorney, and his specific demand that you cease any attempts to contact him directly, and your failure to supply the information he demanded.

-----

Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 4:18 am Subject:

Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 9:55 am Subject:

Shirley,

I know that you are in a dilemma. It's really tough to decide how you should proceed. If you send the �deficiency letter' as mentioned by Virginia Legal Defense (Dan), you risk the chance of receiving more aggressive calls. I really doubt if these people know what the right process of validation is!

Have you tried to settle the account with OC? Perhaps OC would help you in this matter. Keep us posted.

Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 11:03 am Subject:

Thats the thing about it Stanley, I have wrote the original creditor and they said they are no longer 'servicing'my accounts. To talk to CAs.

Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 12:04 pm Subject:

Oh! Nothing is left for you but dealing with the CA!

As Virginia Legal has mentioned, the situation defines what you should do next. If the amount is affordable and it's far away from 7 year reporting time, you might like to pay it.

If the debt is past SOL and going to get off very soon, there is no reason to disturb the system. However, if you are planning to apply for a mortgage or any other loan, you might want to achieve a good score. In that case, you can consider paying old bills also. But you should think again and again before taking any decision.

And never pay without making an agreement. I think you know it very well Shirley Wink

Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 12:09 pm Subject:

I would like to know exactly how paying an old debt affects your credit score. Does it depend on the amount of the debt, how old it is, or does it not matter at all? I want to know if it is really worth paying something that is out of the SOL if I can pay it in one payment. I hate that there is some "magic formula" that the credit bureaus have that we don't really know about. I do want to pay all my debt, trust me, but I want to know what to concentrate on. As I understand it, as collection accounts get older, they don't count against you as much in the calculation of your credit score. Isn't this weird? I have read this in several places. It doesn't really encourage me to pay anything. Any ideas? Sorry guys, I'm just rambling, I've been eating, sleeping, and dreaming credit repair for the past few weeks and it's driving me crazy!!!

~Mary Smile

Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 12:22 pm Subject:

IMO, paying old debts affect credit score. Hope you know the SOL story. By paying a past SOL debt you risk the chance of restarting the clock. However, if you pay it in full with one installment, it doesn't matter if SOL is live or not.

Now if you pay an account that is about to go off your credit file, chances are you will not notice any improvement in your score. Score is determined depending upon the data in your credit report. It does not count the accounts that are not in your report any more.

I encourage your idea of paying all your bills. But as I said above, not all the payments influence your credit score.

Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 1:50 pm Subject:

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