AIP in Delaware, BIG in UK (?), CashCall

i can give you some 'advice' on Cash Call. I had to deal with them, too. They are very difficult to work with. Nasty, evil, etc. They make you think THEY are doing YOU a favor, everytime you talk to them. They will tell you they will show up at your door, if you skip a payment, etc. I FINALLY just couldn't afford the payments anymore......they wouldn't help me in any way, when I fell behind. That was almost 2 years ago now. My account was 'sold' to a CA, who I'm having better luck, with this debt now. Cash Call, as you know, is such a high % rate.THAT'S where they 'get you'. They will tell you everything 'under the sun', to get a payment from you. I CAN tell you, there are Lawsuits, AQAINST Cash Call, in the state of California. cash Call ALSO says they won't allow you to put "their loan" into a Debt Program. If you would like to discuss Cash Call more, with me, you can PM me. I do apologize I can't give you any 'real' advice, on your other debts, 'GOLD'.

Hey! Good news for you!!!

AIP and BIG are ILLEGAL in Oregon! Oregon recently passed some new laws making ironclad that even loans taken out over the phone or internet must be licensed and must follow Oregon law.

I also had a Cash Call loan, and defaulted on it a couple years ago. I ended up getting sued by them . . . .

Hey, I live in Tualatin!

Another thing - About your work. Tell them all now that you just found out your ID was stolen and someone took out some loans in your name. That way when these companies do start to call it won't look bad on you.

Also, if you know someone that answers the phone, tell them to tell people calling that you don't work there anymore, if that's possible.

Here You will find the Payday loan laws for Oregon (just select your state),
http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/paydayloan/explain-pdls-laws.html

Emails to and from OR Banking Dept:

Hello,

Can you give me a summary of the new payday loan laws that went in to effect on July 1, 2007? And can you clarify if internet based companies must now be licensed by Oregon to lend to Oregon consumers?

Thanks

Response:

The following is a summary of changes made to consumer finance, payday, and title lending by
the 2006 Special Session and the 2007 Legislature. This letter provides information on some of
the most frequently asked questions on the new consumer finance lending laws that take effect
July 1, 2007.

* Limits interest rates on payday or title loans to 36% per annum.
* In addition to the interest, allows a payday or title lender to charge a one-time 10% loan
origination fee on a new loan ($10 per $100) up to a maximum of $30 (regardless of the
amount of the loan).
* Sets a minimum term of 31 days for both payday and title loans.
* Limits payday and title loans to two rollovers/renewals.
* Prohibits a lender from making a new payday or title loan to a consumer within 7 days on
either side of the date on which a payday or title loan expires.
* Allows a lender to charge only one fee for NSF and dishonored checks, regardless of the
number of checks written by the customer; the fee is limited to $20.
* Allows payday or title lenders to pass through to the borrower any NSF or dishonored
check fees an unaffiliated financial institution charges the lender.
* Includes ???????sale-leaseback??????? arrangements in the definition of title loans, thus prohibiting
such arrangements unless the lender-buyer is properly licensed.
* Prohibits lenders from charging any fees other than those that are specifically allowed in
the payday and title lending laws.
* Starting July 1, 2007, you are limited to charging a maximum 10% loan origination fee
(based on amount loaned and subject to a maximum of $30) and a maximum 36% per
annum interest rate on all new loans. You must calculate interest on a 365-day year.
(Lenders have the option of using a 366-day calculation for leap years.)
* On July 1, 2007, interest rates and fee limits become effective. You can collect the fee
(finance charge) that you stated in the agreement that the borrower signed before July 1,
2007. However, you must use the minimum 31-day term and the maximum 36% interest
on any renewal of a payday or title loan on or after July 1. You must also comply with the
$20 maximum NSF fee limit on any returned checks you deposit on or after July 1.

What do I do if I decide to change my business model to make short-term loans only
through the Internet, mail or telephone?

You must provide information to our office describing changes in your business model. If
you are making loans to Oregon residents, licensing and complying with the new laws are
still required.

What does it mean?

They can only charge you 10% origination fee, and 36% interest. The origination fee can only be charged at the start of the loan.

The loan can be rolled over twice.

There is a 7 day waiting period between loans.

Loan terms must be at least 31 days.

Internet lenders must be licensed by OR to lend legally.

Where to Complain, Get Information:
Regulator: Oregon Department of Consumer & Business Services
Address: Division of Finance & Corporate Securities, 350 Winter St. NE, Rm. 410 Salem OR 97301
Phone: (503) 378-4140
Fax: (503) 947-7862
Regulatory Contact: Charles Donald,, Supervising Examiner, Non-depository Programs

Call them also. Charles Donald actually retired a year or so ago, but the new guy Mike is really good. He can help you deal with the 2 payday loans . . .

Do you have any other payday loans, or just those 2?

And have you read this thread about closing your bank account?

http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/paydayloan/close-account.html

cash call is not a payday loan

Yes, that is true. They are an installment loan, backed by the First Bank of Deleware. Federal law allows FDIC insured banks to import their home state's interest rates and licensing status . . . . Making them legal.

I actually resolved my AIP "problem" just through the BBB. Have you filed a complaint with them? I even got a refund from the illegal bozos.

goudah, what happened when they sued you?

I defaulted, on the loan, almost 2 years ago, now. It was close to a year before my account, with Cash Call, was 'sold' to a CA. Cash Call DID threaten to sue me...however, never did.

cannr - I filed a complaint with the BBB on AIP a couple days a go. How the heck did you get a refund from them? I still have a "loan" out with them. I've decided NOT to close my checking account (the one I took to "loan" out under with them, but I'm still not sure what to do this Friday, April 4th, as to whether I should put enough funds in there (I had my direct deposit stopped so I now get a physical check)to pay them off and be done with them. Also, if they get the complaint before Friday, are they going to start retaliating/calling me at work just based on that? I just can't have them calling my work - PERIOD - WAY to disruptive as I've had other issues at work regarding my finances. Too risky for me.

AIP didn't call me once. They know they are illegal and usually (I said USUALLY) don't rock the boat a whole lot. When I filed my complaint, it was because they were illegal AND I have overpaid the prinicple amount of the loan (like WAY over). So, in my complaint, I stated all that, blah, blah. And AIP responded with marking my account paid in full and also issuing me a refund of xxx dollars that I had overpaid and even apologized. LOL! Now, if you still owe them money, how much do you owe them? Have you paid them the principle amount of the loan? If you have paid the principle amount of the loan, you are done. If you have overpaid the principle amount, they owe you a refund. If you haven't paid the principle amount, only pay them the exact dollar amount to have that amount paid in full.
How much did you borrow and how much have you paid them so far to date?
Also, what did you say in your complaint to the BBB?

I've taken out several loans with them over the years. Paid the fee a few times, then paid off the loan, re-loaned with them off and on, etc. On the current $200 loan, I've "extended" it multiple times, and it's well over $200, i.e., I've extended at least 3 times, probably more like 6. I probably didn't use as precise terminology as you did, but I asked for a refund of all the $89 fees I've incurred over the years - I guessed about 30 since they were illegal. I said that I just want to be done with them, and that the balance be taken care of as "paid in full", but if I had to ask for a refund to accomplish that, then that's what I'm doing. I'm still scared they're going to call me. I get paid on the 4th. Do you think they will know about the BBB complaint by then if the ACH bounces? Should I put money in there to cover it if I don't want to risk them calling me at work? Also, do you know anything about BIG? How should I deal with them since they are likely overseas and I have no address for them and they're "call center" in London says "they're not allowed to give it out". I've "done business" with them for a very long time. I think they used to be under a different name, which I can't remember, but it always works the same way. You borrow so much money - say $350, the first fee is $80, and then it goes down $5 each time until it hits $40. $40 is as low as it goes. I'm now at $45 on the current loan. Once you pay it up, they bump up your borrwoing amount $25, but the fee goes back up to $80, then goes down $5 each time, etc. I know they're illegal, but what do I do? Goldhelmet/Brian in Lake Oswego, Oregon. P.S. I also have some internet PD loans - Eastside Lenders, Total Lending, United Cash Loans Impact Cash, Payday One ( I think they're legit because they charge exactly what Oregon State law charges now, as well as installment loans with Think Cash and CashCall.

Brian, if you feel "safer" letting them take out one more debit, then put the money in your account just to prevent them from calling your employer. Although, I swear, they never called me. AIP will usually have like 14 days to respond to the BBB (that's usually how many days the BBB gives them). I was more specific in mine telling them exactly what I paid over and above the 200 loan. It was a couple hundred more! So I demanded a refund. Now, I don't know about the past loans. Most pdls consider them "done" and can't go back and claim refunds on them. They concentrate mainly on the current loan. So, you can demand a refund of any amount over and above your 200 loan. BIG operates the same way; however, BIG is a pain in the a$$ to deal with because they ignore EVERYONE. They will ignore you (unless they're calling your phone 100 times a day), they will ignore the BBB, they will ignore your state AG. They just totally blow them off completely. However, they will harrass the living hell out of you. I couldn't get crap out of them. I overpaid (of course) and filed complaints. They ignored them all. And they continually called me until one time I couldn't stand it any longer and actually answered one of their calls. OMG. I think my head was going to explode. I argued with these idiots for about 20 minutes and decided I had wasted 20 minutes of my life on them and hung up. We went back and forth regarding the fact that I "still owed them 200; however, they would settle for 100 sent via Money Gram". Ummm... I had WAY overpaid that loan. There was no way in hell I was sending another dime to the illegal idiots. So they continued to harrass me by phone. I changed my phone number. Sorry about their luck. My state AG had no luck with them whatsoever. Didn't surprise me one bit. You can actually stop paying them - period. But, a warning, they will call you until your head falls off. So, you also have:
Eastside Lenders
Total Lending
United Cash Loans
Impact Cash
PaydayOne
Think Cash
Cash Call

I've had Eastside Lenders (they are another one hell bent on driving you insane) and Total Lending.

You're right about PayDayOne, I do believe they are licensed. I think.

Think Cash and Cash Call are installment loans, so they're totally different than pdls. In a nutshell, you're going to have to pay them the outrageous amount of money they want from you.

Can you list for me how much you borrowed from the pdls and how much you have paid so far? I can check to see if they're licensed for you.

cannr - Tegarding BIG, does anyone have an actual address for this company? The call center is in London, but they won't give out an address for the company - major red flag. Sounds like I'm going to need to pay them in full when I'm able to, never use them again, and then quickly change my checking account #'s. Sound like a good plan? They won't take partial pays/pay downs, only the fee or total payment. They really are scum. I can't pay them in full in the near future, so I'll have to keep paying the $40 fee every two weeks until I'm able to pay them off.

Total Lending, Impact Cash, and United Cash Loans are 1st time loans. I've paid Total Lending and UCL one $90 fee each. I can't continue this, so I think I'm going to tell them to pay off the whole thing and let them bounce, then try and work out payment plans with them. Same thing with Impact Cash.

How do I get a password so I can log in as the same user each time? I've requested a password for my email address several times and it never came to me.

Brian, send an email to Vikas at
vikas(@)debtconsolidationcare.com
He can help you with your log on problems.

I'm going to look into your others pdls. They may be illegal for you also. If you're thinking of letting them take pmt in full and then having them bounce, you're going to rack up a boat load of bank fees. And there's always the chance that the bank will pay these guys and then you owe the bank. That would suck. When are they scheduled to debit you next?

Total Lending and United Cash Loans, Friday, 4-4. Impact Cash, Wednesday, 4-2.

All the pdl's mentioned above are illegal but Payday One in Oregon.

Goudah- Thanks for the info. What does that mean for me practically speaking, in terms of a plan of action? I.E., Ok, they're illegal, but what now? They still have my checking account info and a written contract (even though it is illegal, they obviously maintain it is). We're advised not to close our checking accounts, so that's out. So they'll just keep debiting me right into account closure and ultimately Chexsystems. I just don't know WHAT to do...

Why are you advised not to close your checking account????

You absolutly need to close it.

What it means when I say they are illegal is that they are unlicensed and not allowed to lend to Oregon residents.

This means they are not entitled to collect any interest. The loan is void. It is uncollectible.

Have you filed the complaints with the Oregon Dept of Banking yet?

brian,the pdl's will advise anything that is to there benefit.you said they are not legal,so there contract is also not legal.please close your account asap.they will debit forever if you allow it.

So even if I took:

$300 from United Cash Loans and have payed them one $90 "interest" to date;

$300 from Total Lending - same thing, $90 paid to date.

$260 to Impact Cash - no payments to date.

I can still close my account? There is a post up "before you close your checking account becaaue of PDL's". That is the one I'm referring to. Won't they still harass me and debit my account? Won't my bank still possibly force throught he payments and overdraw my account? This is also the checking account I have that AIP is to debit again on 4/4. Won't AIP make my life miserable at work as well?

Help !!! I'm so confused as to what to do...

it depends on the circumstance,but as goudah stated those loans are illegal therefore you are obligated to pay back what was borrowed.you should do this on your terms not theirs.yes they will harras you,but know just about everything they say is hot air.they can't do any of it.as far as the checking acct goes you can put a hard debit block until you can find another acct.talk to your bank manager face to face.explain your dilemma.they should help with that.

You have to close the account - It's the only way to stop them. Otherwise they will continue to debit and debit . . . .

brian, goudah is in your state. goudah knows her stuff. Since she has found that your pdls (with the exception of one) are illegal, you need to prevent these illegal ones from debiting. However, I'm thinking it might be too late to totally close it right now without the risk of it being forced open due to pending pdl debits. What you can do, is go to the bank, speak to the manager, and put a hard debit block on that account. Nothing will go through. Not even your stuff, so you'll need to open a new bank account somewhere else so that you will have a "working" bank account. You need to do this, brian. The illegal ones will debit you into the thousands. You can close/block your account. You won't get into any trouble. You can then (after you know your bank account is safe) send letters to your illegals pdls telling them they are illegal and that you are only paying back the principle amount of the loan - no illegal fees. The one legal pdl, you would have to contact and make an alternative payment plan - no debiting your bank account. We have a good letter to send to your illegal pdls, brian. But, your first step is to get that account at least blocked. You don't want any more pdl debits.

I had so many PDL's, at one time, I HAD to close my account and open a new one. With the LEGAL PDL, I think you can send a Money Gram ( that kind of thing) for a payment. Don't give out your bank account anymore. Everyone, on this forum, is giving you good advice.

Thank You all for your input. I appreciate it more than you'll ever know. :D

Well, I DID in fact CLOSE the checking account this afternoon with my credit union. All the illegal PDL's with the exception of BIG - unfortunately - are set up there. I asked what the ACH policy was and they said that they do not force an account negative if ACH's come through after the account is closed. The account is just closed period. I also had to close my savings account, so I get a whopping $5.62 refund tomorrow. At least I can afford lunch tomorrow. :D

While I did not speak to the branch manager, it was someone I know who has worked there a long time. I was anxious to get the account closed ASAP and I was doing it at a few minutes after 5:00 pm PST over the phone. I'll talk to the branch manager to follow up, but I think the advice I've been given is sound - it's riskier to leave it open and let them debit me into infinity.

Now if I can only get these people not to call me at work... :shock: :oops: This is SCARY stuff folks. It is really reassuring to know that many other people are going through or have gone through the same thing. I felt completely and totally alone before. You guys/gals are the best !!

I get paid this Friday with a physical check, which I have complete control over. That feels really good. It's horrible to go in on payday and see 1/2 to 3/4 of your check gone - all for fees/interest and no reduction of principal.

Oh, brian! I am sooo happy! :D You're account is closed! No more pld debits! Your first step on the road to recovery! And, you're about going to flip out when you actually get a WHOLE PAYCHECK and can pay your bills and get some gas, and gee, maybe even some food! Oh, the days of getting paid only to have it sucked out the same day leaving me with nothing. Oh God. The nightmares. Congratulations on your progress so far! Make sure to follow up with the manager, just to play on the side of caution. Now, what account information does BIG have? They will be the ones to debit you until you are dead in the ground. Is there a way to stop them?

I'll ask you this, brian. Do you have a receptionist at work? Or do your calls go to your voice mail? Or how do you receive telephone calls at work? I might have a few suggestions to get these guys off your a$$ at work.

Thanks cannr. I'm really excited and scared at the same time. there's still a long way to go but I feel like I took a huge step forward today.

BIG. That's a real tough one. Unfortunately, before I found this forum, I gave them my checking account info with my other checking account - USAA in Texas. I talked to USAA today. They said that BIG first has to debit my account before they can send out a form to me to fill out "under penalty of perjury" not to let BIG ACH my account. Changing account #''s wouldn't help because the two accounts would still be connected if they kept debiting - which obviously they would. This is the checking account that I need to keep open. Closing is NOT an option. This is where the "legal although not moral" debt goes (Cashcall, ThinkCash) and a couple Prosper loans. I got on with USAA before they changed their membership requirements, so I can't close the account and be eligible for membership later. I can't get a checking account anywhere else because I'm still on chexsystems. So, they will debit $45 on April 9th,and then $40 on April 23rd - every two weeks after that it's $40 into infinity until I pay them in full. The principal amount is $350. I'm not sure what to do at this point with them. I spoke to them today and asked them for a physical address again, and of course, they refused. I told them they were offshore and illegal and what the state law was in Oregon. She tried to say that it did not apply because I first applied for a loan with them in 2005 before the legislation was passed. I told her that was total BS because I payed that off and then they called me back saying my credit limit had been raised and offered me another loan AFTER the Oregon law was enacted. She continued to insist it was all legal of course, and at that point I let loose, really let loose, and yelled and told them they were the scum of the earth and asked herself how she looks at herself in the mirror, etc. Boy did that feel GOOD. :D :D I then called back and spoke to a nother person and politely verified with him that they were debiting my account on April 9th and he told me "to have a good day". :shock:
But really, I'm not sure how I'm going to proceed with BIG. I guess I will let them debit the $45 on the 9th, and then ask USAA to send me the form, and I'll request them not to debit for BIG anymore. Doesn't BIG just harrass you to no end, just like AIP does?

BIG is the worst when it comes to telephone calls. They will hit your phone up to 10 times a day if not more. They are horrible. I guess your only choice with BIG debiting is to get the form from your bank preventing them from debiting, which I hope is soon because they will debit you to death. And they will call you to death. Oh my God, do they like to make phone calls. :evil:

We do have a receptionist. I work in customer service, so personal calls are highly disruptive and our management really frowns on it. There are also multiple people who spell the regular receptionist throughout the day.

I also don't know if I gave all these people the general number that goes to the receptionist or my direct #. But I'm sure they will get creative. They'll ask for HR, they'll ask for my boss, etc. That's where it really gets sticky because my finances have resulted in some embarassment at work in the past. From what I've heard regarding AIP, they call lseveral times in an hour. Maybe some of the people who've been harassed by AIP or my other PDL's can chime in. I did file a complaint against AIP with the BBB in Delaware a few days ago.

brian, I was hoping you could make "friends" with the receptionist and have her field your calls for you. Otherwise, I would suggest (which may not be possible for you) to have someone convince these pdl idiots that you "no longer work there". Worked for me. But I work at a small office. As far as any pdl calls, they were told "she is no longer with us". Done. Didn't call my employer anymore. They hit my cellphone with a vengence though! :lol: Honestly, AIP never called me. Never. I don't know if others have had problems with AIP harrassing them, but I sure didn't. And the BBB complaint will probably work out in your favor regarding them. I'm concerned with BIG. They will call the hell out of you.

Well, as long as I keep paying them the $40 every two weeks, they won't call me. But obviously, that has to stop sometime. These other ones were higher priority for me because they are $90 every two weeks and I'm not in danger of defaulting with BIG since the fees are now lower (relatively speaking). At some point, I'll probably just pay the loan off and then fill out the form with USAA to never take a debit from them again. Oh, and I'll never take out another "loan" with BIG ever again!

brain, it KILLS me to see you paying these illegal jerks their 40.00 every two weeks! Man, that money addes up FAST. I don't think I even want to know what you've paid them so far towards the principle balance of your loan.............. :shock:

That's easy cannr - in their eyes $0. I've paid $80+75+70+65+60+55+50 = $455 in fees on a $350 loan. It starts at $80 and goes down $5 every time until it hits $40. There's no limit to the number of extensions! How is THAT legal? It's not. When you pay it back, they call you back and say since you've been such a great customer we're raising your limit $25. Then you start over again at the $80 in fees and so on and son...BIG SIGH. So, If I were to pay them off today, it would require $395 (350 + 45). :twisted: :twisted: They don't take partial pays or pay downs - in other words, you either pay it off or pay the fee - nothing in between. This keeps people paying fees into perpetuity. They won't give out an address. I also suspect they are involved in the identity theft business, selling the information. Speaking of ID theft, AIP scares me too. They get you on a three way call with your bank, and while they're listening, you give the bank your secret question (mother's maiden name). Man I'm glad I closed that account!

Hey - You CAN get another checking account!!!

We have an expert here, MCA, and she has helped many people on Chexsystems get another checking account.

I'd recommend you open another checking account, maybe 2 at 2 different banks, and have 1 checking account be the one you pay Think and Cash Call with. Only put enough in each month for the payments. The the second account is your good account. Give no one this info.

You also could pay Think and Cash Call with money orders. They cannot require you to pay by ACH debit, it's against the Federal Electronic Funds Transfer Act.

G - I took care of Think Cash and Cashcall today. I spoke with them both and asked if I could stop autodrafts from my checking account and pay by either money order or moneygram. They both said yes and I faxed both of them my ACH revocations for my open checking account. I told them verbally over the phone to never contact me at work under any circumstances an if they need to call me to leave a message on my answering machine at home and I would return their call within 24 hours or the next business day. They were very agreeable to that and notated that request on my account. Also, in my fax, I added a "cease and decist request" regarding calling me at work. Our company receptionist has been told to forward and outside calls for me straight to my voice mail.

That is a plus...tht they are working with you. I have had some calls here at home from BIG and at work, but I work nights and they must not be deligent enough to stay up late and call at night?
The woman who works the desk at our place can be a bear and I am sure that she has been abrupt with them? Or prhaps they are only calling the switchboard and getting no where. My manager/supervisor ignores them or tells them to call me at home.