Collection Agencies reporting derogatory info to Credit Bure

They are coming after you 6 months after you left the company to repay commisions?? Did you sign anything when you left that would have left you responsible for any commision overpayment? Personally I would tell the to take a hike....you left the company which puts the company responsible for maintaining the account. I googled United Investigators and came with nothing. A search on Stuart Allen brings up a site that shows that they do investigations....I am wondering if the so called investigator was really another collector from within the company which would be a violation.

FIRST RULE OF DEALING WITH COLLECTORS...NO VALIDATION...NO MONEY!!!

ALWAYS send a DV letter to a CA. They need to provide certain information to you so that you are positive that they are the ones you need to pay. If they can't provide validation, then they must cease collection activity.

I am assuming that you had a contract with Prudential, or at least some sort of written agreement covering those commissions. I know it is common for companies to chargeback commissions on products that are cancelled for a refund of unearned premiums. But for them to chargeback, it should be in writing somewhere that you agreed to it and that they intended to do it.

Definitely demand an accounting of those chargebacks before you pay anything. They could be making up #'s for all you know. And if they ever wanted to sue for it, they would need to show a judge their accounting. So they have to have it. Also request a copy of the agreement that allows them to chargeback any commissions.

*ALSO*!!! -- Last year federal courts ruled a CA only has permissible purpose to pull your credit when the original debt stems from a credit transaction. A COMMISSION IS NOT A CREDIT TRANSACTION! The CA was quite possibly breaking the law by looking at your credit report!

See a thread I posted here, regarding the federal ruling, and a memo from Transunion to that extent. http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/collection-agencies/notice-sent.html

My point, instead of paying them, now you may be looking to sue them.

Now to your questions:
1) CA's generally can report the debt to the bureaus. (That is not against the federal ruling). Some CA's report, some don't. If they haven't reported by now maybe they won't. But making a "partial" doesn't mean they can't report.

2) Your score was affected when they pulled your credit. Your score will be affected even more if they actually report that debt as a collection item.

3) If you're going to pay it, you will want something in writing from them as to the amount owed. Keep proof of payment towards that amount. And get a paid-in-full letter when it's done.

4) Settling by itself won't affect your credit. This goes back to #1/2 whether they actually report or not. If they do report, a "settled" collection will still hurt your score.

5) The settlement offer depends what the CA/Prudential is willing to accept. Try 40%, they may refuse. Try 50%, they may refuse. I've found 75% is usually accepted.

6) It wouldn't hurt

7) You can try. Again, it wouldn't hurt.

8) Send a DV to Stuart demanding an accounting and evidence that you agreed to the chargebacks at the time of your employ. Also throw in that they broke the law in pulling your credit and you just might sue them back. Prudential, by retaining the CA, is also responsible for the CA's violations of any law. Draft a cleverly-worded letter to Prudential telling them that Stuart broke the law and they may be named as a co-defendant should you wish to sue for violating the Fair Credit Reporting Act. They may crap in their pants a little and drop the whole issue for fear of you suing them.

Thank you all for responding. DebtCruncher, thank you for your sage advice.

I did sign a contract at the beginning of my employment with Prudential, and am assuming - but not certain - that there was some sort of recaptured commissions clause in there.

I already sent in a good-faith payment of $100 yesterday, by check. I have my copy, the delivery confirmation receipt, and an e-mail I sent to the collection agent informing him of payment and included the delivery confirmation/tracking number.

Should I pull my own credit reports from the three agencies: TransUnion, Equifax, and Experian in order to see if any debt from this CA has been reported?

Since I was barely contacted by the CA two days ago, would it already be posted by now?

Could Prudential have reported it to the CRAs?

Lastly, getting anything in writing from CAs is a nightmare (as I can tell by reading other threads), how can I make sure that the CA does send me a paid-in-full letter when my settlement offer/entire debt owed is finally paid off? They may ignore me, or worse sell my info off to a junk debt agency.

P.S. I will draft a letter to Prudential informing them that the CA illegally pulled my credit report when, as you mentioned, the original debt stemmed from a credit transaction.[font=Arial][/font][color=Black][/color][size=3][/size]

You sent them a "check", they now have your banking information, that is a no no, always send a money order or a bank certified check and send it by CMRRR so that you have proof of payment.

hiya---


My thoughts are different than yours--but then again when it comes to collection issues, I tend to have an "attack" mentality I guess.

OK, you signed a contract. Have you reviewed it? One very important thing to remember about this is that signing a contract in itself is not necessarily legally binding because many contracts, if challenged, would turn out to be legally unenforceable. For example, in your case, I would argue in court that the loss of the client was 100% resulting from Prudential's own unprofessional handling of that client's money, and not in any manner affected by anything you did....therefore, I dont see any reason at all why they should be able to penalize you for their screwup. Thats how I see it. If I were in your position right now, to be honest, I would be calling my bank and putting a stop payment on that check. Then I would tell "Mr. B" that validation is required before one penny will exchange hands. He cannot legally say "you dont need validation" or "I dont have to give it to you"--the law allows you 30 days from initial contact in which to dispute the debt or any portion of it. Nothing he says changes that.

Bottom line, I honestly feel that youre getting shafted here. And I would fight it. Also, as mentioned already, this is not a credit transaction, so they dont have any business pulling your credit reports at all. Thats a violation of federal law right there. A question over earned commissions is not a question over a credit transaction. I think its time to fight fire with fire.

Right on Sky, couldn't have said it better myself.

After reading your comments, I now realize that i should have fought fire with fire. I just absolutely HATE the fact that low lifes that work at CAs can harass a person without the least fear of the law, and also that they can MAJORLY screw up a person's credit by submitting all sorts of derogatory remarks to CRAs.

I know that there are laws that protect people from harassment by creditors/CAs, but unless you record your phone conversations, there is not proof to hold-up in court.

After reading a 'Guest' comment in this thread, I realize how trusting and foolish I am for sending them a personal check!! I thought that having my carbon copy of the check I sent to the CA would protect me from the check-by-phone scam. Should I change checking account numbers? I pay all of my bills through my on-line bank's bill pay feature, and only have one video rental service on automatic draft - so it would really be no hassle.

I also, now, have correspondence with the CAs agent through e-mail. I have the reply from Mr. B that he received the check today...he even wished me a pleasant weekend!! lol If I send the request for verification of debt in e-mail form, is that legally binding, i.e., will it hold up in court in lieu of the CMRR letter?

Also, seeing that this guy is now addressing me respectfully, and he has proof that I am willing to comply, will I have better chances of getting a lower settlement amount? I guess that I am referring to the old saying that one can attract more flies with honey than with vinegar. I'd rather not pay the total sum of $2,180, and right now I couldn't pay it even if I wanted to.

From reading other threads, I picked up some settlement 'tips'...
1) You can usually settle a debt for a lower amount at the end of a quarter, or toward the end of the month? - as collection agents are 'scrambling' for bonuses/higher commissions.

2) If you want to settle for 40% of debt owed, start off with an offer to pay 25%, and that payment, if settlement offer is accepted, will be overnighted. Most say that you can ultimately reach your target goal of 40% with this type of strategy. Of course, I will write something along the lines of: "Final payment for settlement of disputed commissions Prudential, file #xxxx" in the memo line.

Are these 'tips' accurate?

Also, once debt is settled, would it be a better time to go after the CA and Prudential (as co-defendant) because they pulled my credit report illegally due to the disputed 'transaction' stemming from recaptured commissions and NOT an actual credit transaction? (i.e., CA won't be able to begrudgingly refuse settlement offer or hit my credit report with more derogatory entries because the case will be closed and settled).

Last two questions:
1) What is best method of obtaining my credit report to check if any derogatory entries have been made as a result of this Prudential commission fiasco? I have a friend that works as the finance director at a local new car dealership. Should I have him pull my reports from the 3 CRAs, or should I do it myself? What will impact my credit least?
Also, would the derogatory remarks already appear on my credit report if this fiasco just begun on Tuesday? In other words, should I wait a week or two more before pulling my credit report in order to check that it is the most accurate and up-to-date report available?

2) Once settlement has been accepted, final check has been cashed, what further steps, if any, do I need to take to make sure that these jokers at Stuart Allen & Associates delete/close my file AND also, that they don't sell it off to junk debt collectors?

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU in advance for all of your support, assistance, and advice.

I would open another account and close that one ASAP. The reason the CA appeared nice is he nows has your banking information. See how nice he is when he discovers that you stopped payment or closed out your account. Send the DV letter by CMRRR rather than by email. You have to have proof that one was sent if they continue to try to collect or take you to court.

IMHO, I would think that now that the CA has received money from you, he knows that you have a source of income and may play hardball with a settlement #. Just my humble opinion.

I have also noted that they do not usually offer settlements until the account has been uncollectible for some time, at least in my case. What about the rest of you? Doesn????????t it sound odd that they offered to ???????settle???????? off the bat? Also to take into consideration is that by paying this $100 ???????good faith???????? payment not only haven you given them your account information, but you might find it a bit harder to get them to validate since they can now saw you acknowledged the debt by making this payment.

Also, start right now doing everything in writing usps certified mail return receipt because emails have upon occasion been contested and from what I have seen can be iffy if it goes to a court of law.

You really want to see a copy of the signed contract and go over it with a fine tooth comb, make sure it even says they can do this plus the stuff mentioned before is good???????..why should you be penalized for the company????????s screwups?

Also, the CA is supposed to give you 30 days to dispute. Get a DV out asap, if it isn????????t on your credit yet they CAN????????T put it on until after they validate. I would immediately send the CA a letter and explain that you have stopped the payment and closed out the account. Tell them you felt pressured to make this payment and in fact feel you do not feel obligated to pay until you have the signed contract and a detailed breakdown of who canceled the policy and so on. I would also mention that they already broke the law once by pulling your credit and that you are considering suit.

I would also send a letter to the company and inform them that their CA is acting unethically and violated law (like was mentioned earlier).

Great response Golden..

I will go ahead and close my account, and open a new one.

I will also send out the CMRR DV letter. Once this info is sent to me (if at all), and I do see that my Prudential Financial employee contract does state that I must repay the recaptured commissions, then I guess I have to pay, right?

I have good credit, and have never been late on any of my payments, never been in default, and up until now, have never had an account in collections (damn Prudential!!). So even though I have outstanding debt (approx $50k), I should have a good credit rating. Obviously, I want to check out my credit score/reports from the 3 CRAs to see if any derogatory comments have been submitted.

My questions are:
1) What is best method of obtaining my credit report to check if any derogatory entries have been made as a result of this Prudential commission fiasco? I have a friend that works as the finance director at a local new car dealership. Should I have him pull my reports from the 3 CRAs, or should I do it myself? What will impact my credit least?
Also, would the derogatory remarks already appear on my credit report if this fiasco just begun on Tuesday? In other words, should I wait a week or two more before pulling my credit report in order to check that it is the most accurate and up-to-date report available?

2) Once settlement has been accepted, final check has been cashed, what further steps, if any, do I need to take to make sure that these jokers at Stuart Allen & Associates delete/close my file AND also, that they don't sell it off to junk debt collectors?

You can get a free copy of your credit reports once per year. You want to do it yourself because if anyone else (like the dealership guy) does it, it will show as an inquiry and that will impact your score.

You can pull now and if they are not on then that is good, because if you DV the CA they can't put it on until after they validate.

As to what you should do if they do validate, I am not sure. You could fight it. It would likely take you having to take it to court and fighting it their.

Goldenbast, thank you for your response.

I will go ahead and pull the reports myself. Once I do pull them, and if no entires have been made by the CA or Prudential, and I am making good faith payments until I can save up enough money to settle for around 50% (hopefully CA will accept), can they still make a negative entry on my credit file during this time that I am making payments, or even after it is settled?

Lastly, how can I be sure that a junk debt buyer (JDB) won't buy my file/info from this CA once this matter has ben resolved/settled? I've heard absolute horror stories about how these fly-by-night JDBsoperations are the biggest frauds and identity thieves out there today, and trying to get them to correct any entries on a credit file is nearly impossible.

This is why you need any settlement in writing and to have it in this settlement paper that the account is closed completely, that no portion of this account will be sold. Technically, once the account is 'closed' they shouldn't sell the remainder and any JDB who gets this can't legally collect upon it, but why go through all that hassle when you can have it in writing so that if they do sell it, you can nail them for it.

Good faith payments won't stop them from reporting, again, unless you have it in writing. I did that once with a CA, I agreed to make payments but I demanded it in writing and that also in writing that they would never report it....they did send me this letter because I basically said no letter, no money. :)

Goldenbast, thank you for this response!!

It is sage advice, and it truly gives me a little peace of mind because at least now I know how to approach things and not get taken advantage of.

Do you have any sample letters to address the points you made above:
-no reporting on my credit file
-no selling off any portion of my account to a jdb

For how long after all has been settled and finished with, must I continue to fear the possibility of any more fallout/unexpected bull crap collectors trying to dig up anything? I just fear that once your (sensitive) information is in any CAs system, it spreads like a wild fire to other CAs and JDBs.

Well, most of my letters are tailor made and all settlement letters generally are just a rehash of what was settled over the phone. I have no trouble talking to CAs, they don't fluster me in the least, but many people advise to stay off the phone with the CAs and that is good advice unless you have a strong foundation and know exactly what your rights are. Me, I have fun with them on the phone...I don't consider it a good call unless I make the CAs cry. :)

Did you DV them already? I'm already posting so can't go back and look. Just make a very simple letter, stating what you are willing to settle for, or what payments you are willing to make. Also stipulate that the settled amount closes the account in full with a zero balance and that any remainder, or any portion of this debt will not be sold.