I did it! Sent validation letters!

You have made the first move towards repairing your credit. Now the companies receiving your validation letter have to prove you the accounts and their legitimate existence. They are bound to reply within the fixed time period. If you don't hear from them within the 30 days period, you have your base made stronger and contact the bureau with an explanation that the said company failed to validate your debt.

As per the fdcpa laws, the companies receiving your validation letter should not call you until the debt has been validated. Neither they can hit your file nor can they enter any negative remark. If they have already done it, they need to prove the item in the validation process or remove the item permanently from the file. In any case, the company tends to violate the laws; you have a FDCPA umbrella that can be used for protection and preventing willful injury.

I'm looking forward to the next steps that you mention, because I know 1 of the accounts isn't mine, and I'm almost positive on another one of the accounts. Thanks for your post John!

~Mary

You have thrown the ball at their court. Now it's for them to return back your move. Keep us posted.

Good luck waydizzy..I hope you hear back from everyone. I sent out 8 and got only one response back and it has been almost two months.

Well TMD, I'll take what I can get I guess...at least I am doing my part!

~Mary :)

It sounds like you took the first steps, Mary. Good for you! I received one back today regarding an old debt of my husband's. They are going to remove it because we've shown the account was paid two years ago. It was a mistake on their end. They were trying to collect on the account twice.

Yep, it's smooth sailing from here on out...as long as I start making some money at work :)

~Mary

Welp, here's a small update...the first letter was accepted! Guess we'll see how this goes. I wonder how long it will take for them to respond? :?: :?: :?:

~Mary :wink:

OK, now 3 of them out of 4 have been accepted. *waiting*

~Mary :)

Good luck! I hope everything works out well for you.

Mary,

CAs should respond within 30 days. If they cannot, you can send the second letter with copy of the previous one.

Hi Stan,

Make that 4 out of 4 accepted...nobody rejected the letters! LOL! That's a good sign, I guess. I am keeping VERY good track of dates and such, so I will stay on top of the 30-day period. I am even printing out the e-mail that the USPS sends me to update the status of each letter. I am going to do this the right way!!

~Mary :)

Well Mary, keep in mind that you may not hear back from everyone. I have sent out SO MANY validation request and only received two back--and I've been at this for a year now--. One of the two, wasn't even a validation--its what the CA was calling a validation but its not what I asked for. (the last six payments made on the account in 2002). The other one was a medical debt. I've noticed that when you ask collection agencies to validate medical debts, you'll get one back to you almost every time! No one else has responded. And it really puts me between a rock and a hard place because these collection agencies aren't on my report anyways, so its not like if they don't validate, they have to remove themselves from my report. They're not on it. But you know what, looking at it from a different angle, since they can't or haven't validated, they can't go on my report, so at this point, what I'm doing is keeping them off. The original creditor is still on and reporting me as charged off. So keep in mind, you might not get the response that you're looking for (on the ones that are really yours) but at the same sense, if they're not reporting on your credit report, then they can't until they validate it to you. so something else for you to think about. Also on the two that you think aren't yours, if you don't get a validation back, send your dispute to the credit bureaus, they HAVE to investigate them, and if they turn out NOT to be yours, they have no choice but to take them off.

shirley

Well, I figured I wouldn't hear back from everybody. None of these are medical debts, so we'll see what happens. Actually, my medical debts were actually "joint accounts" (or actually it says "participant on account") so I was thinking of trying to have them taken off my credit report and keep them on my ex's report. He said he would write a letter stating that he wants to do that. Kind of the same thing you did for your husband, right? I'm hoping this will help, because there are like 6 medical bills on there that are "participant on account". That would be a huge boost in my score if those were taken off! Not that I'm counting on it, I'm just hoping they will go for it.

And as far as the ones that I don't think are mine...I hope they aren't mine anyway! I would love to get those off my credit. I wonder how big of a difference that will make in my score. Looking foward to finding out though!!!

~Mary :)

Mary,

Are all the accounts with ???participant on account' mark appearing in your report only? Or they are in your Ex's report too. Is there any particular procedure to remove joint accounts from any of the participant's credit report?

Hi Stan!

They are on ex's report also. He agreed to write a letter stating that he takes responsibility for the bills and that he would like them removed from my credit report. I do not know of any specific procedure for doing this, but I figure if I write a letter with the account information and explain the situation, and attach a letter signed by ex, I have a fighting chance. I have heard of this working with the bureaus before, and I figure it can't hurt to try!

~Mary :)

It really sounds good. It appears that your name will be taken off as a participant through this process. You are right Mary; there is no harm in trying this. Best of luck.

Thanks Stan! I'm just glad I got him to agree to write a letter for me :lol: I'll keep you posted on this though and let you know how the process goes!

~Mary

Well, a small update - I got back one of my little green cards from my certified mail. I am pissed! Obviously, they had to sign in order to receive the letter. But whoever signed for it, in the little space that says "Received By (printed name)", They just made a capital N with a scribble after it!!! They shouldn't be allowed to do that?!?! That isn't cool. The postman should make sure that they print their name appropriately! Whatever. :roll:

~Mary

Mary, I've gotten a few back like that before too. I understand what you're saying, but the fact is, they signed for it, they've received it and you have proof that they received it!!! Thats the whole bottom line of what we're after, making sure they get it, and that we have proof that they got it. That way if something ever comes up to where they cart you off to court and they tell the judge that they never got anything from you, you have your copies of the letters and the green cards to prove otherwise. So it puts you in a good place. I, myself, am building quite a paper trail. EVen though I'm not hearing from the two companies that have me pulling my hair out (dell financial and wells fargo), I still continue to send them letters, certified return receipt. That way if they take me to court, I can show all of this to the judge and prove that I have tried taking care of my responsibilities. That it was them being difficult. And I'll have all of my letters and green cards to prove it. shirley

Well Shirley, you certainly are right, I should be happy that they received it at all :) I just get so frustrated, sometimes I feel like it is "me against them" and they are trying to screw me somehow by not putting their name...I guess when you stop and think about it, it really doesn't matter :) Thanks Shirley!!! :)

~Mary

I have a few observations stimulated by the posts I've read so far in this topic:

1) There's no thirty-day limit for the debt collectors to response under federal law (fdcpa); there may be one under the laws of some states, and someone has intimated that Texas has such a requirement. But it's best to see the demand for verification as a "put up or shut up" sort of thing. If they can't supply verification that there's a valid debt and that the person they're trying to collect from is the debtor, or supply the identity of the original creditor, then they have to stop the collection process unless and until they can produce adequate documentation. [Addendum: there is a 30 day limit for "reinvestigation" of consumer debt data held by credit bureaus under the Fair Credit Reporting Act, 15 U.S.C. section 1681i.]

2) They don't have to produce what you ask for (though that should not stop you from asking) but they have to produce sufficient documentation which, if it were introduced into evidence in a trial on the matter, would be sufficient for a court to rule in their favor. That's not "you're definitely liable", as you may have defenses, including the statute of limitations, fraud, estoppel, waiver, setoff, usury, recoupment, or even that the plaintiff isn't the person you borrowed the money from (or, for that matter, isn't a "person" in your state because of a failure to register as a corporate entity). Instead, it's more a matter of establishing a prima facie case. It's like the "probable cause" standard in criminal cases. If they can produce a document with your signature on it by which you agreed to borrow money at a particular interest rate, and a statement of account that shows that you did in fact borrow the money, that's sufficient. At that point it would be up to you to say, "but I never signed that" or "your statement of account is wrong, I never borrowed that money" or some such. And, if (when) they don't believe you, you're probably headed for court (at least you should be, because if they keep up, you should file suit against them for declaratory judgment).

3) Make sure to get copies of your credit report and to send letters to your file with the credit bureaus explaining why the stuff in your file is in error or misreported.

4) Registered mail, return receipt requested, is ok, but lots of times, they'll let registered mail set in the post office until the three attempts to deliver have expired. Now, all you have to prove is that you mailed it to them, you don't have to prove that they got it. But what I do is to send stuff first class priority mail, with a certificate of mailing, and with delivery confirmation. That way, the USPS delivers it, there's no opportunity for rejection, and I get confirmation of actual receipt. Make sure that you send the demand for verification to the correct address. The P.O. Box listed for sending payments is almost never the correct address. Find out the street address of the corporate headquarters by consulting the secretary of state or whatever agency regulates the registration of corporations in the state where the debt collector is chartered (either by telephone or via website - most have online databases where you can get that information for free), or send it to the address indicated on their demand letter under the heading, "other correspondence". If you use the former approach, however, you can find out the name of the president of the corporation; if you address the demand for verification to a corporate officer (i.e., president, vice president, secretary or treasurer) it puts them in the weakest possible position to deny proper receipt. (If you send it to the wrong address, that's like not having sent it at all.)

5) You have thirty days from the date on which they send you the first notification to you of your rights under the FDCPA. They're supposed to do that in writing within five days of their initial contact to you, whether they called you on the 'phone, emailed you, sent a demand letter, or whatnot. If they never send you the required notice ("you have thirty days in which to contest the legitimacy of the debt", or the equivalent), then you can send in the demand for verification any old time. But once they send you the "you have thirty days" notice, you've got thirty days from receipt of that notice to send in your demand for verification. The date on which you actually receive the notice is day zero, start counting days from "one" at the day following actual receipt. If you wait beyond the thirty day limit, you lose your right to demand verification, but not the right to make them stop contacting you. [Addendum: you can always ask for verification, you just can't sue them for failure to stop collection efforts if you wait beyond the 30 days.]

[Further addendum: Under the statute, all you really have to say is that you dispute the debt and that you want the name and address of the original creditor.]

So, if we are past the 30 days to verify, but still want info on the original creditor, what type of letter do we send...not the validation letter right? I have one from a "law office"...maybe, not sure if they are actually a law office, not sure what they are. But, they sent something that they are trying to collect for a CA, but nowhere on their letter does it state who the original creditor was, and since I never recieved anything from the CA they are talking about, I am only guessing by the amount what account it is for. I am thinking the letter they sent me probably violates the fdcpa just because it states nothing about the original creditor..am I right?

First thing to keep in mind is that law offices that have a substantial debt collection practice are "debt collectors" under the fdcpa, so they probably have to follow the same rules as any other collection agency.

Even if you're outside the thirty days, you can still send the demand for verification letter. They don't really have to respond, but most reputable collection agencies will treat it as if it had been sent in time. Doesn't cost much to try.

If all you want to do is to find out who the creditor is, photocopy the letter they sent you and staple it to your letter in which you say, "Tell me the names of the original creditor and the present creditor on the purported debt you identified in the attached letter from you." Really that simple.

My standard demand for verification includes a demand for that information. See Example of FDCPA "Demand for Verification" letter" (multiple posts on the same page - the first two lack the courthouse picture):
http://forums.debtcc.com/collectionrecovery.html

Well, here's a weird update....I got a package of papers in the mail today from Professional Collection Consultants (I finally know their whole name, LOL!). They sent me a HUGE pack of papers regarding a Cingular account that I am 99% sure I paid. Included in the package was a copy of my contract that I signed and a bunch of copies of previous statements. The final bill that they included does in fact say that I owe the amount they are trying to collect on. But I know I paid this!! I have no idea how I am going to prove that....I will dig through my old credit card statements (actually, my ex's statements, since he paid it with his credit card) and try to find it. This is going to be a pain, but I know I paid over the phone with an automated system. Arrrrrgh!!

Now here's the weird part about what they sent me. At the end of the package is a bunch of bills that don't belong to me! They belong to some other girl who owes a whole lot more than I do. And then behind THOSE bills is a bunch of other papers regarding other people's discharged bankruptcys.....WTF?!? Did this guy just pile all the papers on his desk and shove them in an envelope for me?! This pisses me off! I don't want to know anything about somebody else's bankruptcy stuff. There are 12 forms, plus the fax cover sheets, for all these people from different states who have had bankruptcy! How unprofessional is that?? I feel like I shouldn't even look at them, I feel bad for these people who are having their papers tossed around. I would feel really violated if somebody did this to me! I wonder what my next step should be? Should I write the guy back and ask if he wants his papers back?? LOL...I've never seen anything like this.

~Mary

Quote:

Well, I sure as hell am not paying this other chick's bill, it's over $1500!!!! Screw that!! *grin*

I wonder how much these guys make, seriously?! Is it so little that they just don't care about privacy and such? LOL....I just sat there and laughed when I saw all this private info....and the bankruptcy papers with all these people's addresses?! I would be so mad!!!!

~Mary <--just shaking my head at this one...

Hey Mary, are there contact numbers for those other people?? You may want to call them and tell them what happened. get them upset and maybe they will file a lawsuit against this jerk (j=lemme guess.. Superior Asset ?? oh wait they never respond to anything).. I think there maybe something in the law that requires them to take certain measure to ensure information is kept confidential...

Yes, there is plenty of contact information for these folks..addresses and phone numbers for all of them. My mom suggested that I do something about it, but I wouldn't know where to start, other than contacting these people personally and letting them know what happened. How rude of this collector to be so careless with other people's personal information!!

~Mary

Well, I got another valiation letter, if you can call it that. I don't think so! It just tells me that Adelphia submitted this account to them for collections on June 29, 2002. There is an outstanding balance of $79.21 and the disconnect date was May 23, 2002. An update has been sent to the three credit bureaus advising that I dispute the account.

Does this count as a complete validation letter? What is my next step?

~Mary

I think you have got a better response in comparison to what others have received in the name of validation. You can call the Consumer Protection Office to know if they are authorized to do business in your state, or call your creditor and inquire if this is a legit company. Then make an agreement and pay it in full ??? get rid of another one.

Also ask them to report your account as paid as agreed or paid w/e.

BTW, have you checked SOL for the said account? How far is it from 7 year reporting time?

Hi Stanley :)

I do agree, I feel lucky that I received anything at all. I will look into calling the Consumer Protection Office and see what they have to say.

It is out of the SOL in 2 months, but it is 3 years away from being at the 7 year mark.

I have a question for you Stanley...have you ever heard of writing what is called a "pay for delete" letter? I have read of it on other forums, and that is what I am going to try with this one. From what I have read, if you ask nicely, you can make an agreement that the item will be deleted upon payment in full. I have read from others that this works almost every time, so I think it is worth a shot at least. Since it is so close to the SOL, I figure they might go for it, since they are getting full payment and in a couple months they can't sue me for it anyway. Stanley, have you ever heard of this, and what do you think of it? Thanks :)

~Mary

Quote:

I really wish I knew what to tell you. I'm sure someone here would know. I would contact the Federal Trade Commission since it was sent by a collection agency to get their opinion on it. I would feel uncomfortable calling strangers but that's just me. I'm sure someone else can direct you better on this but it sure makes me wonder what the heck this guy was thinking.

Thanks for your opinion, as always Mishele :) The more I think about it, the more obligated I feel to do something about this situation. It just isn't right for this guy to dump a bunch of personal information of other people onto me. My mom suggested that I send a letter to every person on there...and as a matter of fact, a lot of their ATTORNEY'S NAMES AND PHONE NUMBERS were on there, maybe I should call some of them? I dunno...LOL...such a weird situation.

~Mary

OK, small update...

I sent a debt validation letter for a Time Warner account that was on my credit report. I haven't heard anything back from them yet. However, I still have online access to my experian credit report. Just for fun, I was checking it, and that account has disappeared! Maybe they couldn't validate it and already pulled it off??? I have no idea what happened, I am still waiting for a letter from the collection agency, but yay me for now! :) I didn't know that in that period of time that you have online access to your account, you can see anything that changes as well!! Hopefully it was also removed from the other CRAs. Cross your fingers for me :D because that account WASN'T MY FAULT!!!

~Mary 8)

I would call those people and let them know that you're mailing their personal information to them because you don't need it...And let them know who gave it to you including his name and contact number if you have it. That guy should be fired! This is how identity theft happens.

What a moron!

LOL, that is one of the many options I have considered! I plan on using this to my advantage though either way 8)

~Mary

You could use it as a "blackmail" kind of thing..Remove your reports from the credit bureaus, or you'll turn him in for being an idiot. :)

Kidding--Kinda..Blackmail is never right. :-P

Uhhh...yeah....I wasn't thinking of blackmail at all.... :twisted:

Actually, I was thinking more along these lines...I'll pay it in full, and you delete it from my credit report for being a moron :wink:

~Mary

Quote:

I wish some of these goofballs on my report would screw up like that...lol

Try it and see how it goes. :)

Shirley - I pulled my Transunion, and it is still there. But maybe they are slow to update? I dunno. I can't afford to pull another one yet, but give it time...I will. On another positive note, pulling my Transunion again, I see that another one that I attempted to validate (that funky Bank of America account) is gone! So things are looking up either way :)

~Mary

Jessi -

I am considering writing a letter to this guy...just to say "Hey...how about you take my payment and delete the account off my credit, before I report you to your supervisor and 20 peoples' lawyers..." Wonder how much poo he can fit in his pants....LOL

~Mary

LOL You could even enclose a copy of all the stuff he sent you, but keep the originals to give to the rightful owners.

And the stuff he gave you--Wouldn't that be validation items for those people? That collector is going to be in SUCH bad shape when this is all over with.

heck Mary, depending on what you owe, they might just discharge it altogether for that screw up!!

Quote:

Jessi - I thought about enclosing a copy of everything he sent, but I want him to beg for it back! LOL :) I almost feel sorry for him sometimes(depending on what time of the month it is, LOL) but damn, he needs to be more careful with private information like that!

Shirley - I thought about the lawsuit factor...I won't tell anybody if they drop the account entirely...it isn't REALLY my account anyway, I just signed for somebody to get cable/internet...still thinking about it :)

I might as well jump on Transunion and try a dispute...can't hurt, right? :) I just noticed that 3 charge-offs disappeared from the negative area...I guess they were probably bought by somebody else...those are the ones that I JUST YESTERDAY wrote a letter requesting removal since I was only an authorized user. LOL! We'll see what happens with that.

~Mary

[quote=Mary]I wanted to bring this back up since I didn't get too many responses on it. Isn't there some kind of privacy issue here?
[/quote]
This is definitely against privacy policy. Moreover, they have disclosed the debt obligations of others to you and this is illegal according to fdcpa, right?

I think all of you should stand united against this bad practice. You never know if they haven't sent your information to some one else already (God forbid). Consult a lawyer if you can take any legal step or not. Keep us informed on what is going on.

I do feel that this is a violation of the fdcpa.

I wish I could afford a lawyer, Stanley...I am going to have to find one who will take the case for now and take payment out of whatever judgement is decided? I don't know how this works, I've never even come close to taking something to court :)

~Mary