I can't believe i'm saying this on this forum out of all the forums.

You have just said what I have been thinking myself over the last week. I am on the edge between settlement and BK and it really makes me mad that the millionaires get a clean slate and not even a slap on the wrist. I am working 2 jobs 14 hours a day and can get sued or my wages garnished. I think they should just give us all a one time clean up. Just let us start over. I am 54 days late on one of my accounts and am really not that worried about it. Thank you for expressing for me!

hummmm I'm not sure what to think or say about this post. I personally don't think it right to "just" not to pay your bills. I know a lot of people that work for the credit card industry and if we go charging up bills and just decide not to pay them back we are hurting a lot more people than the "credit card companies" I'm not sure that I agree with the wall street bailout, however, something has got to be done, or we will all go under. Its to late to agrue why it happened, it happened and now it must be fixed! You chose to take out those credit cards, no one held a gun to your head, you are repsonsible for paying them back. As for the PDLS that are not legal, again you took out the loans you should pay back at least the principle. I'm sorry if this sounds nasty but I think you should re-think your decisions.

lmale, in times like this, you have to look out for yourself. these companies don't care about your well being, all they want is your money. this same fiscal responsibility that you preach is absent by our government and they get bailed out, so why can't I get bailed out then. If they don't pay, why am I stuck paying still.

I've got no problems with paying your bills. My problem is the hypocrisy of the wall street bailout and how the american who will be paying for the bailout is still stuck in quicksand.

you can pay your bills and continue to fight the quicksand, but the quicksand will eventually envelop you. look out for yourself, stand up for yourself, don't continue to be a tool for them to use. they are not better then you.

I feel your pain, I really do--and although I'd love to see someone stick it to the man right now, the man still has power to royally screw you over--not so much with internet PDL's, which are mostly illegal, but definately with credit card debt.
It's a fact of life in George Bush's America: the rich have gotten richer and the Middle Class is dying. And the bailout? I say put all the CEO's on trial and give the golden parachutes to the workers. And as usual, the workers, the tellers, people in the call centers and behind the scenes, will be the ones feeling the real pain.

I don't agree with the bail-out, but it's not "free money" that the government is giving to these companies. The government is simply buying and taking ownership of all these defaulted mortgage portfolios.

Going back several years, these companies made bad business decisions and gave mortgage loans out to people who they probably shouldn't have given loans to. Now those people can't afford the payments and all these mortgages are defaulting.

Problem with the government doing nothing? Well, A) all these people are losing their homes to foreclosures. B) The lenders' liquidity is gone because all their money is tied up in bad real estate that is not selling, or selling far less than par. They're not in business to sell real estate, they're in the business of making loans, and without any liquid capital they can't give any new loans out and therefore can't make any money. I know, boo hoo big bad corporation. (Guest says "it really makes me mad that the millionaires get a clean slate.")

Problem is, who owns these corporations? Not millionares. WE DO. These are publicly traded companies. OUR 401K and retirement plans are made up of these companies' stocks. If these huge corporation go bust, it's not the millionares who lose -- it's you and me who lose our retirement vested in these companies.

On top of that, if the company's had to BK, it wouldn't mean all these people get free homes. The trustee/receivership would actually come in and want to liquidate all the company's assets - and so it would make them foreclose a lot quicker to get that real estate turned into liquid cash. Bottom line in letting the companies fail, people lose their homes and their retirements.

Enter the government "bail-out". Like I said, the government is not giving free money. They are just buying up the defaulted mortgages. In this event, 1) it gives the lenders some liquidity in which to resume normal business; 2) when those mortgages are backed by the government, foreclosures will go down. Theoretically it's a relief valve, and may push the economy a bit in the right direction. I'd assume the fed is looking several years down the road, when the economy is back on track, and the government will be able to sell these mortgages back to the private sector, or else sell bonds against them.

Now I don't agree with this whole "bail out", I just wanted to shed a little more insight. But I also don't believe it creates an excuse for everybody to stop paying their bills. Creditors will still sue, and if you're on the receiving end of a lawsuit, this whole "bail out" is not going to be a valid defense in court. If you need a bail out, the government has one, it's called bankruptcy.

Yes the CEO's created this mess, they have their big salaries and golden parachutes. When/if the government steps in, they'd better clean some house. BUT the CEO's were appointed by the shareholders. Did you know as a shareholder you can vote for the CEO? How many of us actually send in the proxies we get in the mail every year? How many of us have a 401K or IRA and know what a proxy is? So it is easy to blame everyone else and say we're such a victim, now I want something for free because of it. But nothing is free in this world; and those who think they've gotten something for free, will end up paying for it somehow.

these times are scary, i know this. every month it seems i am scared of not making rent or having my electricity cut off. i also am disgusted by how the big companies always get bailed out.. it seems like nobody looks out for the little guy! but from experience with foreclosures, something has to be done. it's not even just the people losing their homes.. nobody's even buying them because the money they owe is so much more than its even worth! what happens than is that the bank is stuck with it, has to sell it and has a lose. which means laying off of jobs, etc. it really is a big cycle.
i do try to make good on my payments. i am having a bad year and am behind. thanks to this board, i managed to settle with several credit cards and all but one payday loan. that said, i always pay rent, car, etc. before even thinking of my debt. if i had the money, i'd gladly pay it all off today but i just cannot afford it. just ignoring your debt will only hurt you in the end, so i do hope you reconsider - i had to pay literally double on a credit card because i ignored it for too long.

DebtCruncher ,

It is a useless bailout. We are seeing this as mainly a morgtage problem. Which it basically is, but the reason behind a majority of it is because the cost of oil. It controls everything. People get pushed further to the brink, can't make bills, morgtage, go into default. It is a trickle down effect where it eventually hurts us all. Bad thing with no alternatives in line in any forseeable future, it will just continue to get more & more expensive, and there will be no magic recovery, and this 700 billion will be pissed away and it will just be a band aid for a few years, then it will happen again. The government is just trying to hold off the inevitable. Survival of the fittest is how it should be. I feel sorry for those who will lose their investments, but maybe they should have sold, or should sell now to minimize losses.

In a few years we will see it all happen again because with this bailout, the companies didn't need to adapt to the new world with this bailout, just business as usual till they go belly up again, but on our dime this time.

I'll tell you....if a judgement is placed upon you....you have a legal right to appeal and this could takes many months if not years and during this time....the creditors are not allowed to try and collect this debt....if you clearly show that you have a hardship.....the cc will usually set up a payment plan or settle. In the environment today....its likely they'll grant you an extension to pay or reduce balance(settlement.)

I understand your point, but in the end, your credit will be shot - Wall Street will still be able to get credit, you won't!

No need to cut off your nose to spite yourself! Again, I understand your position and in an ideal world that would be great. Unfortunately, we don't live in an ideal world.

I wonder what would happen if 1,000's of people did this? We need a revolution. That "Credit Card Bill of Rights" can't come fast enough.

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Am considering my options (i.e. bankruptcy or negotiating directly with the card companies) --- but simply stopping and going underground isn't the answer. They will find you and as someone already pointed out --- you'll be looking over your shoulder forever. Prefer facing the embarrasement than be looking over my shoulder.

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here is something to think about, maybe the bank would not need to be bailed out if you all paid your bills on time

troll..
can someone please delete this?

Actually the troll" has a point. Why if someone has a point of view other than yours be called a 'troll"

Vikas' defense to all the threats of lawsuits over the years has been that he doesn't censor the content of the boards and therefore it's a free-speech issue. It was a really good defense too, that has worked for a lot of other siutes that maintain bulletin boards and were sued by private parties and regulators because of things that were posted on those sites by members and guests.

Why did this site get away from that over the past year or so? The mods are so quick to lock threads and delete posts now that it's hard to have any kind of discussion on the boards.

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Have you bothered to read some of the posts that the mods put up, Chrys? Was Soaplady "civilized" when she told a poster to go learn English? Was Mergel "civilized" when he attacked two posters simply because Paul had never heard of CSO's in Maryland or that his own congressman had introduced a bill (and held a hearing where Jean Ann Fox testified!) to "reform" payday loans?

refrain from personal attacks - MOD

Welcome Kashzan...now go away!

THE PERFECT PEOPLE AND PERFECT BANKS.
JUSTIN 1978...
HOW OLD ARE YOU?DID YOU BORN YESTERDAY?

since the first post was directed at me, i will answer.
they are a troll because of the way they had their point across.
the post said "here is something to think about, maybe the bank would not need to be bailed out if you all paid your bills on time" which to me seems like it's own attack, and i agree, would scare people who really need help from posting because most people are so ashamed to begin with.
so yes, i do think that was a troll who posted purely to stir up trouble, but that is the last i will say about this post.

I dont think anyone dosnt want to pay there credit cards. Its the enormous interest thats killing everyone !!!!!

I have stopped paying my credit card debt also and I understand the consequences of ruining my credit and I am willing to accept this.
As far, as dealing with the calls, I have an answering machine turned down and the phone ringer turned off, so I can avoid the calls while screening the ones I want.
When it comes to a judgement by the credit card companies, I plan to attend court and tell my side and show my hardship and why I have been unable to continue this vicious cycle of trying to stay on top of things.
Whether or not you agree with my decision is your choice; but do not feel guilt towards not being able to pay my debt. Between losing my job and having to take a part-time job that pays pennies, this is the only way I have of dealing with my debt.
It is time for me to understand that paying your rent, food, and utilities should come first. Also, I did contact all of my creditors to explain my situation; the ones that were willing to work with me I am still paying; but the ones who were not; I chose not to allow them to guilt trip me. In this day and time, I agree whole heartedly with taking care of yourself and survival versus feeling ashamed of not being able to pay a credit card.

How will you judgement proof yourself? Curious...

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The financial institutions have long since given up any right to be hold moral claims over anyone. In playing into their hands, you are in fact complicit in the abuses they propagate--not paying them the money they demand is not just morally permissible, it is praiseworthy. Those of you who continue to pay are contributing to the problem.

As a side note, the consequences of not paying are really not as terrible as the propaganda would have you believe. You will not go to jail, your life will go on smoothly. You'll get a few phone calls from bored, robotic voices, and numbers you already don't care about will go up and down in some desk monkey's computer. You'll not borrow any more, but that doesn't seem like a bad thing.

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Statutes of limitation on debt collection/collectors by state.
http://www.bcsalliance.com/y_debt_sol.html
Click the "scavenger debt collector" link as well for more enlightenment or
paste: http://www.bcsalliance.com/y_debt_scavengers.html

Now for a little personal info on dealing with the Credit Card Mafia.
I beat them..you can too. If they try to screw you...screw 'em right back.

I got my first CC at 19 when I moved out of my parents house. It was
a local department store card.. Lechemere..a venerable old massachusetts
company..(killed by the national chains ..but thats another story).

I built my credit over a few years to an AMEX Gold, MC and Visa, Discovery, Sears etc..even a Diners Club.

Always paid on time and always more than the minimum (usually between 6 and 8 percent of total owed) infrequently carrying a total debt load of
about ten percent of my gross annual income.

Ok ok ok...i'm sounding like Joe Pesci in that Mel Gibson cop movie..
so..
ended up getting divorced from the cheating skank..and thats when the
"Credit Assessments" started. In case you didnt know, back around 2000-2001, most likely going back to the Reagan era (Keating anyone?) there was apparently some small print lingo in scumlegalese that I, as well as many others, had no idea about.
As we are all aware now after the big bailouts...bankers, stock brokers and
investment firms, advisors et al..are the scum that are destroying the country.

Anyway, I get notified by my CC carriers that they will be raising my APR's because i have been "assessed as a considerable risk". After many hours
of trying to determine the basis of this assessment I learn that the divorce
and the change of employers is the cause. Not my payment fidelity, not
that I actually made more ...nope...their little derivative deducing computer
program deigned me a risk...and they were going to jack my interest rates
up to a level Don Corleone would be electrocuted for..so I kept just an
MBNA Visa (AAA auto club issue) and a Discover card (Sears origin).
The MBNA visa card was a palatable 8.99 percent APR that was agreed upon and issued at that rate when I took it out. I hardly ever used the Discover card without paying it off immediately.
I'm going to cut to the chase and say that MBNA pulled or tried to pull every bait and switch and other scam on a scam in ways not believed.
I sent numerous registered and certified letters..(duplicate, since there
was NO discernible contact for grievance) and finally sent a check
with a disclaimer on the back stating that if the check was cashed then
MBNA considered any remaining debt "paid in full" unless ongoing correspondence was in effect. I owed $6500.00 more or less in 2002..
I have a fat folder of correspondence and I never paid them another dime.
My Credit report shows they wrote the debt off before the end of that
year. Then sold it to the supreme scum that is the scavenger debt collector. And one scumbag sold it to another and lo and behold..the debt "grew" to over $11k..how that can happen by non bank or regulated creditors is one of the more amusing things...These sphincters make their own rules and no one is paying attention. They do respond well to the fact
that you know where their office is located and that its a nice parking lot.

In closing, I still have the Discover card..but at 18% APR if I feel like carrying a balance I'm gonna have to look elsewhere. I would recommend the effort of dispute communication attempts with anyone who reads this. Keep a paper trail and know your states laws and fed regs. Once you stop paying the usurers they will certainly attempt to contact you...most times illegally,and you can sue the scum for more than you owed and then some.
Oh..and my credit score was pretty much unaffected...just lucky I guess.
Doing it all over again....I think I would have left a bigger balance to make up for the crap i had to deal with.
Shakespeare was wrong...the lawyers would be third in line.:rolleyes:
Good luck..

nice way to defend the fucking gready credit card companies that jack rates and charge all sorts of fees and take advantage of the american people. Think before you speak, do you know the millions these greedy basterds make a year in interest? I think you need to do your home work before blogging bull-Shit

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they won't let you just pay back the principle. they change the terms, jack up your rates, tack on the interest, then charge you over the limit fees, and the consumer can never, ever, pay them back. most people have paid them back the priniciple! we can never accomplish all the fees! GET REAL! The credit card companies are out to make money, and they ARE! THE ONLY WAY THEY WILL BACK OFF THEIR RATES IF THEY ARE FORCED TO, AND THEY ONLY WAY THEY ARE FORCED TO IS WHEN THE PEOPLE CAN NO LONGER PAY!