What is in the stimulus bill?

From what I'm hearing, it's a bunch of needless spending.. (not like that's not suprising). I heard one demorcate say that the total "stimulous" would only be something to the tune of 144 million? (If I heard it right).

We do have a choice and im hoping to get the word out before its too late to sign this patition. Thanks for posting i hope its a big topic of discussion -What is in the stimulus bill?

they have made the comment that they could pay off every americans mortage for less than this bill. They could pay every working american 10,000 stimulus check for less than this bill. There is alot they could do for this type of money that would really help the american people but instead they are spending it on needless programs that wont help us the middle class at all. In the end all we will be recieving is a bill of our own

Actually, i'm not suprised by the needless spending. It was bound to happen eventually. They are just using the current ecomonic siutation as an excuse in order to push all this spending.

I think it is just disgusting, every socia lists dream is in this bill

Do you wanna know, what is in the stimulus bill? Here's what I think. Its sad that the gov. is using this economic crisis as a excuse and they are probably gonna get away with it if we dont stop it. if we dont stop it when is it gonna end? the dems, are trying to use this as a excuse to push everything through that they have wanted the last few years and couldnt get it. to tell you how selfish they are i heard the sec. say "we won the election, we make the bill" like a child fighting over a toy. clearly the people dont want this and they just dont care. they want what they want and thats it. We need to all start standing up for ourselves before they completely take over. I used to think my dad was crazy with all his conspirisy theories but im begginning to see what he was saying. Its scary

If they really wanted to stimulate the economy, they could suspend collection of payroll taxes for a certain amount of time. Just mho...

Suspending payroll taxes would be great....
Unless you are one of the growing thousands who've lost thier job and can't find another one.

Again,
I don't think you can simply blame "the dems". It's business as usual no matter who gets elected.
Again, remember Bush's "stimulus package" of handing out billions to financial institutions (the so-called "bailout")?
All that gets done these days is blaming everyone else for the mess and argue and argue and argue over how to serve the special interests while pretending to serve the American people (and getting the gullible population to go along with it).
Greed and complacency are the germs that will kill this country from the inside.
chrys

Whenever a government gives relief to a company or another country, it goes to corporate debt and government debt, not the individual employee/customer/citizen. A lot of times this relief is even pilfered by those in charge. It's intended for big business and international politics. The individual who has the real need is left by the wayside so forget it if you think this will alleviate credit card debt for Americans who have been prey to banks for centuries. From what I understand this is what the spark was for Hitler to go ballistic when Germany was in such economic stress before WWII, and his hatred for the Jews who owned most of the banks (since they were allowed to use interest and Christians are not per their religion). In no way am I saying what Hitler did was right, but what I'm saying is: America is slowly working itself into the same situation Germany was in before WWII. Hitler was able to reach the people because of the terrible economic situations individuals were in (not banks or companies). We should be aware that if this continues and Americans continue to be prey for banks and too many Americans go bankrupt, it leaves the door wide open for another tyrant, another Hitler. Obama better address the American people first, not big business, starving countries or...(I don't even want to go there, but you know what I'm talking about). Obama would be wise work "bottom up" not "top down", he needs to start with the individual American, not the big business's or other countries.

Hi fatoldsun_98,
I agree. With the Patriot Act, etc., we have already opened the door to tyranny. It's a short step to go the rest of the way. Either Hitler or Julius Caesar, the Republic is doomed. Unless dramatic change happens fast.
Billions upon billions of dollars are padding the elite in many countries, the finance companies will not stop until they own everything, like a monster out of control. The situation in Fight Club is probably not possible in this day and age, but the ending of that movie was very inspirational to me. People beat themselves up at their command to attempt to relieve themselves of their powerlessness. That's why I love this site so much, so many are ready to lend a hand and say "stop beating yourself up and take some responsibility for your own life. We will help you as best we can, but you have to make the move." Creditors cannot destroy the economy if people won't let them, but shiny and useless trinkets are more important than living on a budget and paying only cash and opting out from the vampire Creditus Horribilus Maximus (sorry, couldn't resist!) who will only drain your blood and your children's blood.... It's an oligarchy, not a democracy, much less a Republic... Oligarchies are historically tyrannical and are completely reliant on public servitude to exist. The serfs weren't freed, they were just given the name of "debtor".
And yet, the oil companies continue to pump out *historic* profits.
Your username reminds me of a Pink Floyd song. Is that the reference by any chance?
smo65d11, some say that the Soviet Union never fell, it just relocated to the US.
All,
I would like to believe that I am just a cynical and pessimistic middle-aged man. But I don't see any change in people in the last few thousand years of recorded history. Cycles come and cycles go, but cycles they are. And cycle they do. Even people who know history are doomed to repeat it because that is what we do - the same mistakes over and over, never learning, always thinking "we are different, we are special, we are more evolved, more advanced, more progressive, smarter, blah blah, blah..."
But it is my refusal to succumb to defeatism that I face everyday with a smile and keep on trucking, trying to help out everyone I possibly can, in my own little way. If everyone held out their hand to help someone, there would be no greed or hunger, and we would live in peace. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one.
[sarcasm alert] By the way, will I now get sued since I quoted something that someone else copyrighted?[sarcasm off]
chrys

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i love your posts Chrys, they are insightful and truthful. Nothing will change unless we all change our ways and make a stand. Unfortunately that i agree with you that is not likely to happen(although one can hope) For the first time in my life i am truly scared for were this country is headed to because of greed and big governement. My dad used to say all the time a new civil war is comming and your gonna see it in your day. I thought he was insane but as each day passes you can see it comming. small malicia groups forming everywere, corruption, we are self destructing and fast. im scared for my child and the things he will see in his lifetime. I have no issues saying im not happy with bushs term either. I have not been happy with the way things have gone in a long time and it seems to go from bad to worse.
fatoldsun, my debt actually caused me physical symptoms. I was literally sick with worry. But now you need to take actions no matter how bad it gets. remember you got yourself in trouble, now you have to face the reality and deal with it no matter how bad it gets. Getting through it stinks i know i been there. but you gotta do it and stick with it no matter how bad it gets. And then the new goal is to never get yourself into this position again.
My suggestion to anyone thats dealing with debt and debt settlement is every dollar counts. Your life should stink during settlement because every available dollar should go to your accounts. Dont reward yourself, dont stop at starbucks, no pizza hut, no bar, no nothing. Reward yourself when its over. Honestly this is a time to reflect. I took the highest amount i could possibly affford through my debt settlement company to get it paid off faster. This left me no room for anything. and if i did recieve extra money i sent it in on my own. I went without things no woman should ever have to go without.(i did not need to make it so hard on myself, there were other payment plans i could have made my life easier but i chose to get it done asap) But in the end believe me i remember how bad it stunk that i will NEVER do it again no matter how bad it gets. Fear keeps me from going back. If you make it so miserable on yourself, you will never do it again trust me.

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has anyone on here actually called their representatives and complained or voiced their support for or against the bill? I did!

I sure have right away first thing monday morning!!! it was on my todo list. (yes i have one for everything i have to do throught the day)

fatoldsun,

Hey! glad to know your doing your research!! keep it up! my only rebuttle to the comments made is from what i remember there really was only one person that was bashing the company that i used and he/she was on the other end the collector. Its the way of settlement. a way to get the negotiations started. start low and work your way up. Im sure with time they would have gone back and forth throwing offers out one going up more while the other goes down until more funds were available. I havent come across any complaints from actual clients yet, but i have been looking! As to when it came to my situation, they were very good to me. You would be suprised as to how many people join these types of companies and dont know that you stop making payments and are mad later. Reseach, do your homework, and know whats up! keep up the good work! I dont usually participate in arguements or lash out over someones opinion. This person was not happy with how things were being negotiated. Their allowed to thier opinion and so am i. yes certain $ amounts will be required of the company to do a 1099 which you will have to claim as income on your next tax return make sure you do or you will get a "friendly" little letter from the irs! credit starts to return to normal after 1-2 years. Thanks for the great self esteem booster! Just trying to be a asset!

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Hi Fatoldsun_9,

I love that album Atom Heart Mother, despite the fact the band members themselves pan it so much (and I, too, like marmalade). It was very progressive and ahead of its time (well, pretty much every album of theirs was). My favorite, though, is still Meddle. I never tire of watching "Live at Pompei".... And the only obscure albums by PF were their soundtracks - Obscured by Clouds, More, and Zabriskie Point....

I think Mr. Lennon would be disgusted. I think that because everything repeated so soon - a stupid war in Vietnam and censorship, and now - a stupid war in Iraq and censorship. Sigh - the more things change, the more they stay the same...

I completely agree with your assessment about the 3rd.

Yes, this conversation is quite enjoyable for me, too.

Hi love_my_things,

Thank you. All this mess began with the massive deregulation under Ronald Reagan. Future generations will wonder why he was treated so heroically for so long. I agree with your father's assessment. I had predicted it to start the downhill slide around 2050, probably because I figured by then I'll be too old to care. 9/11 changed all that and I became very depressed for years. I have lived my whole life in the present moment, not thinking about the past (aside from deep emotional scars - but those were still hurting and so were in the present), and allowing the future to take care of itself. I'm 43 now so my options are becoming less and less these days.

Both,

I appreciate your struggles to keep your head above water these days. It's a real challenge not to succumb to pessimism. Fortunately for me, I am naturally defiant and independent, so I refuse to allow myself the indulgence of melancholy, although knowledge sometimes bring with it it's own sadness.

Yes, I really hope you do stick around and become a member of this community. It really is a wonderful place and there's a lot of great people that regularly post here.

About bank fees: yes, banks are terrible - especially when you have payday loans. There are so many stories here of people trying to close their bank accounts to protect themselves against predatory PDLs - and watching their bank turn into yet another predatory institution. It's really sad. Everyone is desperate, the pigs are at the trough straining for a piece of the ever-shrinking pie (or should I say the leftovers of that pie, grabbed by fewer and fewer. Nearly half the population only own 1% of total wealth. Disgusting). Everywhere you turn, people are there to try and rip you off - like rats on a sinking ship. And they don't seem to care if they hurt lives in the process. And that also goes for debt settlement companies who are springing up like poisonous mushrooms after a spring rain. The power that knowledge brings with it is necessary to wield these days, in order to survive and even get ahead in an ethical manner. There's just no excuse for naivete anymore.

But as far as debt settlement firms go, the FTC is actively investigating them due to complaints by bitten consumers. Again, that's why I think it is so very important - if you are being treated unfairly, against the law, or getting ripped off - complain properly to the proper authorities. Get your documentation, get those statutes and rules together, and let howls of protest reach the ears of the mostly deaf power brokers in the government. The occasional squeak won't cut it. Officially, this is still a government of the people, by the people, an for the people - and the people need to stand up and refuse to be run over roughshod by opportunists out to make a quick buck on their lives and their children's lives.

Somebody (I don't recall offhand who) mentioned that they went hungry so their kids could eat, because they had to pay a crushing debt, and that made me both sad and proud. It's good to hear stories about good parents, with all the horror stories its hard sometimes to see that some people are blessed with *real* mothers and/or fathers. Responsibility seems so seldom taught to the children these days.

I do weep for our children and our children's children.

chrys

You are all way to worried. They know what they are doing up in Washington. We dont have to worry about paying this money back, mainly because it would be impossible for us to do it . The Government will have all of us jobs, a place to live, and three square meals a day. Well of course people in prison have the same thing but we will be able to go to our own bed mat each night and we wont have to worry about being molested like prisoners as we sleep because the government will have already done it to us. Enjoy you trip to Rome Nancy you really screwed us.

its amazing how much this topic is effecting our lives yet we are powerless to change it. numbers speak alot of people talk but no one wants to stand up and fight, but sadly this is what it is going to come to. i am 30 years old and never really paid much attention, and maybe this is the problem most people are so busy in thier lives that they just live by day by day trying to just get through that particular day. When you open your eyes its beginning to be a scary place. We need to start taking action instead of just talking.

this is also what we need to do with these rip off settlement companies and everything else in the world that scams us. complaining to our friends and family is not gonna cut it. write letters, make phone calls, get in touch with others that are taking action, maybe they are doing something different.

we need to stand up and take our own destiny in our own hands.

a few years ago i my sister n law got pregnant. no job not married whatever it happens. so she got on welfare and was living better than my husband and i working 3 full time jobs. and then she moved in with the guy and had 2 more. (she said they were all accidents?! yeah ok.) 3 children in 4 years and her life was good. We have 1 child and everyday is a struggle, we work hard to stay off the gov assistance and she just keeps popping them out. no fear, she knows the gov will take care of her. were is the sence of pride? instead of the gov will take care of me. she gets free heating, free cars, free insurance, now she has to have a job so free day care, food stamps, wic, cash assistance, and on top of that every year scince she has been working now she gets 8-9,000 refund because she gets it all back.

Im so sick of how the gov has made it so easy on people on welfare and so hard on people that are trying to stay off of it. Sadly it seems that they are pushing everyone to either be rich or on welfare. no middle class with every year we get pushed farther down. we dont want to live on the govs dime. we take pride in not needing help we take pride that we pay for our child not the taxpayers, It gets me down, like you said chrys, But i fight back with im making a difference, i pick myself up and say im getting there a little closer everyday, everyday i work on getting completely out of debt 4 years left(few personal/home equity loan) and then its cash for this house. if we dont have cash, we aint buyn.

step up and make a difference in your lives. take charge and say NO more. but speaking is not enough it takes action.

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Hi fatoldsun_98,

Hmmmm, interesting point about love songs. Even more interesting is that I always felt that is pretty much what Gilmour writes when he is on his own (solo albums). But he usually writes it with a lot of holes for the listener to fill in and make it their own. So its maybe not about particular relationships, but emotional snapshots, as it were. In fact, the inside of the sleeve on his 1st solo album has various snapshots of him and his home life. I believe his first one to be his best by far, good solid blues rock. I find the new one rather boring (I did manage to listen to the whole thing once or twice, with effort). But Waters was the lyrical powerhouse of the Floyd, for sure. Pink Floyd is absolutely my favorite band hands down.

Hi love_my_things,
Very thought-provoking post. Many people think the idea of karma is ridiculous, but it is a fact that some people get handed everything, and some struggle mightily and get almost nothing. It makes sense to me why someone would believe such people had past lives whose effects are being felt in this one - it doesn't seem fair at all. Of course, life isn't fair - that isn't it's nature. It only cares to be and to stay be-ing, "quality of life" being an entirely human construct. But that's a *whole* 'nother train of thought.....

Take charge and do not charge it! (Suddenly the Flintstones are coming through the flashback pike, da da da da ta da! Chaaaaaaarge it!!!!!!!)

Hi cathompson,
Welcome to the forum. Thanks for your refreshingly sardonic post. I hope you stick around.

chrys

wow! cool! see, if you do the right thing, good things happen! thanks fatoldsun, i wasnt expecting anything at all just wanted to help with my own experience to ease someone elses pain, and i may get a little back. I know when i took all those bills and placed them on thier desk it was almost empowering. Not that the whole process is easy, but its great to take charge and make a change.


Chrys, as you said, lifes not fair, so you just keep on, keepin on one step in front of the other and eventually you will get somewere. sometimes its one step forward 2 back. But I know that when i was younger, i made some serious mistakes and sometimes i wonder is it my karma comming back to bite me for the things i have done?

But you know, it really doesnt matter, you have to play the hand given to you and make the most of it. LIke you, i find myself troubled sometimes and willing to throw in the towel, but always manage to pull myself through it stronger than before. Someday i will be able to look myself in the mirror and say i made it, and i made it on my own, with no ones help but my own. That day is soon comming, and there is great pride in that.

Hi Chrys,
Oh did you know he wrote Comfortably Numb during the recording of his 1st solo but it was too late to get on to the solo album, so it ended up on The Wall. This was probably better since most of us wouldn't have heard it because solo albums don't sell that well. Yes, I have his first one, I'll check it out for love songs. On his 2nd solo album ABOUT FACE (which has "Love On The Wire") he deceptively wrote some songs that sounded like love songs. For example, "Cruise" is sarcasm about cruise missiles, I thought is was pure genius.
There's so many groups I love from 1965 to 1975, it's difficult to say which group I like the most but if you count total air time to my ears it would most definately be Pink Floyd.

love_my_things:
thankyou.

just knowing i helped is payment enough for me. I have felt your pain once, and know what its like. like i told chrys in a different post, i tend to get pretty personal with my posts, but being on this forum reminds me of where i have been, were im at and were i want to be. Im still not completely satisfied as to were i want to be, but with every new day it is closer to that goal. being here is a constant reminder of where i have been. so in times when i think things are starting to go down hill, its not as bad as it once used to be.

I have 1 consolidation loan and 2 personal loans yet to pay off and i will be debt free in about 4 years. Im hoping this year to be able to save enough to start putting extra on those to have them paid off sooner. I also have 2 cc now scince last year my furnace blew up and had to replace it, i had most of the money saved but not enough to cover some final expenses. So you know thats making me insane that i have those 2 now. one step forward 2 back sometimes but if you look at years, im slowly comming out on top.

love_my_things:
I'm filling out the paperwork as we speak! :)

If you can get home warranty insurance on your home and appliances it could save you money if something breaks again. I know some home owners would prefer not to have a home warranty and just use their savings for this but it's saved me a lot of money over the long haul with 2 air conditioner compressors replaced, water heater, pool filter, etc. with just a 50 dollar deductible.

Hi fatoldsun_98,
I was not offhandedly aware of that, about Comfortably Numb. That song fit perfectly on "The Wall", both in the album, and in the movie. And not typical "love songs" per se, but "emotional snapshots as it were". But it's probably just me. I haven't heard "About Face" in a very long time - more than 10 years.

The trick with being "personal" in your posts is to balance that personablity with humanity and you got it made. What I am trying to say is that you can talk about personally meaningful things without specifying personally identifiable things.

Hi guest,
Great idea on the warranty. In fact, I use extended warranties to gauge the inherent quality of a product, wrongly or no. If a warranty is expensive I'll assume it's because the company feels there is a good chance of it being cashed in. If it's low, I'm assuming that the company is confident that it will not have to repair the product within the time frame allotted. For instance, I once (!) bought a receiver from Best Buy. The extended warranty was around 40 or $50. I balked (with quite an obvious look of distaste and disgust) and I'll be dogged that it totally blew out in 28 days! Worst Buy only automatically offers a 10 day return policy/warranty (because they know they sell garbage). I was so hopping mad I could not say anything but "what the f-" and I stormed out nearly purple-faced, leaving their useless piece of junk on the counter.

Burnt once - no more.

chrys

okay...I'm not sure if this has to much to do with what everyone has recently discussing. But; Why do they keep bailing out all of these companies instead of just letting them deal with their problems on their own and go out of business [ depending on their condition of need]
If they aren't going to bail out my company if its in debt. Why do they get to be bailed out?

sorry if its a silly question. But I am curious.

Julianne - Maryland

its not a silly question. they didnt bail out kmart, they just keep throwing money at it thinking its gonna go away instead of just making the changes. And here they are with thier handout AGAIN. it hasnt even been six months. I understand the jobs thing, but common its getting rediculas. they keep bailing them out and they keep comming back for more. I wish someone would bail me out.

Whats wrong with them filing bk and restructuring? The way things are going no one (well atleast people like me) are going to buy a brand new car for 30,000 when they can buy a foriegn one for 10,000 with 100,000 mile warranty. I would love to buy american but cant afford it.

Frankly i have lost all hope in our gov at this point. I oppologize for my negative attitude im usually pretty positive. but yesterday and today have been tough ones for me. This bill thing got me down. Unless you are on welfare, it really isnt gonna help much. There is absolutely no insentive to make it on your own anymore. and the morgtage thing, well you are going to have to be atleast 3 months behind to take advantage of that. so why be timely? Why do the right thing and pay your bill when if you let it go for a few months you will be able to restructure and for a lower interest rate. Why should i be punished for paying my bill? I will have to pay about 2-3% more interest rate because i wont be able to restructure my account because im on time. Im not on welfare so all thier programs wont benifit us. the only thing we are getting is maybe the extra 10.00 a week in our check.YEAAAA thank you we work for a living and your bailing everyone out including the people who dont work, and you throw us a crumb. to bad in a few years we will have inflation and that 10.00 wont mean crap.

Thank you obama, im bending over and grabbing my knees, i always wanted to know what it felt like.

sorry i think i ment ankles! well you get the idea

As I thought, it's business as usual at the White House. Our government sold out to the banking industry a long time ago.

Putting the thumbscrews on those who are struggling to do the right things is not justice, by whatever name it claims to have.

But anyway, these banks and other large corporations are like countries these days. Imagine stealing a country, yolking its people, make them work to enrich you, and not have to play the part of king. Ownership without ownership. PWND indeed.