Need advice!

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Hi Guest,

Going through your post, I understand that it's quite obvious to have a due somewhere in the past. And even you should not mind paying your debt off. But before doing that, you need to have a proof and a history of that debt. There is no harm in asking the proof as it is permissible by the law even. So you should definitely as them to provide you the proof or in other words, give you the history of that debt which you will be paying. In legal terms, it is called "debt validation" and the collection agency has to do this needful. Otherwise, you can assume that they are tying to make a false statement over the phone and you can file a case against them.

Also, if you can look into the past and try to find out if there was any debt or so really from your side. That will help!

Regards
Roxette

Actually this is interesting, from what you say the collection agency is saying that they don't have to validate because they already claim to have notified you by mail years ago, and you missed the initial 30 day period to have disputed the debt.

The fdcpa allows for verification but it only holds the collection agency accountable 30 days from their initial communication with you concerning the debt, anything beyond that period is just trial and error trying to get them to validate later.

I would still insist on the address to write them request for validation, I would not suggest paying this company over the phone, if you want to pay that is fine, but I can tell you now, that the debt that old is out of the statute of limitations, time barred. Not like they can sue you, if they try then be sure to appear in court to show the judge that the debt is SOL.

I will suggest not communicating with phone while paying money or in other words try to keep all things documented as that is most important in long run.

Vikas

Hi,

Welcome to the debt consolidation care forum.

You seem to be a wise man. :D Every step that you have taken so far is correct. Keep in mind that you should never let out your account number or any financial detail over the phone. Don't pay a single dollar until you get something in writing.

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Hi
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This is a problem, the collection agency is claiming that they don't have to validate the debt because they did send an initial communication. And it is not their fault that the consumer didn't receive it, and they don't have to prove that they sent it.

It is going to be their word against the collection agency, it is a stale mate.

The consumer can continue to send requests for validation as they should do. The collection agency is going to ignore all requests is my guess.

There is no way to force the matter, because more then 30 days have passed since the existance of this account on the credit report.

I think on some of the more agressive boards, some consumers turn to what is called a Nut Case Letter, or an Intent to Sue letter, in other words a ploy of other sorts to try to force the collection agency to validate or cease collection efforts.

I am not familiar with these other letters, but I am sure a google search will pull samples up.

Think it is a matter of determining if the SOL is still in affect, if so then coming up with some kind of settlement, and if not, then sending the collection agency a cease and desist letter telling them to bug off and have no further contact with the consumer.

Don't let a collection agency bully you into paying their way. Take all percautions when paying collection agencies, they have a lot of dirty tricks to garnish checking / savings accounts are trying to get access to credit card information. It is best to keep all payments made by money order (keep copies of the receipts) for proof that you paid.

Thanks everyone for your advice! It's still unclear to me whether legal written notification still applies. The woman from the collection agency told me the address they sent the original letter to.................I never lived at the address she stated nor was I even living in the state that the address is located.
So...now they have tacked on nearly 800 dollars in interest to a debt I didn't know about. And of course she threatened to sue me if I don't pay immediately.

Hi,

:roll: Don't be so confused. The law is at your end, so it is not possible for anyone to hurt you. You need an authentic debt validation proof to make the debt eligible.

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?? 809. Validation of debts [15 USC 1692g]

(a) Within five days after the initial communication with a consumer in connection with the collection of any debt, a debt collector shall, unless the following information is contained in the initial communication or the consumer has paid the debt, send the consumer a written notice containing --

(1) the amount of the debt;

(2) the name of the creditor to whom the debt is owed;

(3) a statement that unless the consumer, within thirty days after receipt of the notice, disputes the validity of the debt, or any portion thereof, the debt will be assumed to be valid by the debt collector;

(4) a statement that if the consumer notifies the debt collector in writing within the thirty-day period that the debt, or any portion thereof, is disputed, the debt collector will obtain verification of the debt or a copy of a judgment against the consumer and a copy of such verification or judgment will be mailed to the consumer by the debt collector; and

(5) a statement that, upon the consumer's written request within the thirty-day period, the debt collector will provide the consumer with the name and address of the original creditor, if different from the current creditor.

(b) If the consumer notifies the debt collector in writing within the thirty-day period described in subsection (a) that the debt, or any portion thereof, is disputed, or that the consumer requests the name and address of the original creditor, the debt collector shall cease collection of the debt, or any disputed portion thereof, until the debt collector obtains verification of the debt or any copy of a judgment, or the name and address of the original creditor, and a copy of such verification or judgment, or name and address of the original creditor, is mailed to the consumer by the debt collector.

(c) The failure of a consumer to dispute the validity of a debt under this section may not be construed by any court as an admission of liability by the consumer.

I fully agree with Jason and feel that when Chad is rest assured that he never lived in the mentioned address, so he needs not to worry much about it. Moreover, if the debt is in the credit report, then it needs to be paid back, otherwise it should be simply ignored. Right Chad :D


Thanks
Roxette

[quote](c) The failure of a consumer to dispute the validity of a debt under this section may not be construed by any court as an admission of liability by the consumer. You forgot to also highlight this...by not replying before the 30 days is up on their initial notice, you do not by default admit you owe that debt and can/may request validation at anytime. I iwll have to look up the case law I came accross on that tho..[/quote]

Those letters the CAs like to send with their mini miranda and the "you have 30 days to request validation of this debt"? It's BS. All it means is if you do not respond they may ASSUME the debt is yours and proceed to collect. HOWEVER, the REAL 30 day validation period actually applies to THEM. When YOU request proof of whatever they say you owe, they must respond in 30 days. Also, they can not report an account that has not been validated nor try to collect on that very debt until it's been validated (when they do this, it's a $1000 per violation) . You can request validation in whatever time you chose, but from the moment YOU request it, THEY have 30 days.

The "catch" is, the validation demand must be sent to the collector within 30 days of the first time they contact you.

Understand: you always forever and ever have the right to dispute the "alleged" debt....forever. What you lose if you don't respond during the original 30 days is their ability to continue to report and collect....which includes entries on all your CR (credit reports).

If you never receive a letter, when you say, does the clock for 30 days start? Well, a lot of debate here on that one, kind of difficult to pin down.

What I do is start my letter with, "On (date) I was reviewing my credit report and found your company is reporting information about an "alleged" debt.

I have never heard of your company, I have never received any correspondence from your company, I have no business with your company."

Do not write that exactly, but the point is to come off immediately in total denial that you ever heard of them. You are attempting to start your own 30 day clock...does that make sense?

Jerry

Hi Jerry

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Hi jerry

:lol: It's very nice to be known to you. Also, I appreciate your view and regarding your signature, I am impressed. :D Keep in touch. Let's be of continuous help to the community.

Regards
Roxette

Hi Roxette,

Even if you don't receive a letter no problem. Your 30 day period clock starts from the day you have reported the dispute to the credit bureau.

Hope it is clear now Roxette. :D

Cheers,
Jason

Thanks Jason for the knowledge. Your posts are of tremendous help to all of us and we get to know so much from you. :D

Keep us well informed and thanks for helping the community.

Roxette

That is interesting approach on trying to set your own 30 day clock, I had not heard that before. The subject of debt validation is not my strongest area, just that I took it literally to mean that the collection agency was released from having to validate.

I know about the final part where it is not saying it is confirmed to be the consumers debt, but that leaves both parties at a stand still -

There are countless times I have seen consumers report back that a collection agency refused to validate, even after a second validation request was sent, or if they tried ITS letter, or even Nut Case Letter, still the consumer has the same problem, a collection agency that interpets the fdcpa as not having to validate after that initial communication is sent to the consumer - 30 days from that time.

I have not been following the more agressive credit repair lately, so I don't know on the legal side what different approach consumers might be using now.

I just know validation is not always successful.

Hello,

I have taken the actions as advised. I have notified the collection agency and the credit agency that I want to dispute the validity of the charges. What would my next step be if I do not receive writen notification from the collection agency in 5 days and credit agencies with in 30 days?

Hi Tara

If the collection agency fails to validate the debt within the required period, you can use your legal right as per the Consumer protection afforded by the fdcpa.

The collection agency is required to remove the alleged debt from your credit file by reporting the debt to be 'Disputed' to the credit bureaus. You can consult your attorney if further actions needs to be taken.

Regards
Roxette

thanks for your response, you have been very helpful.

Jerry or anybody-

Have you found any case law regarding failure to dispute validity of debt after such notice was sent by the debt collector?

Does the "failure to dispute validity" waive the right to dispute the debt in the future?

What happens if a debt collector alleges that a demand letter (30 day notice) was sent to consumer and it was not returned for bad address - does this automatically waive the right to dispute the validity of debt?

Thanks
Robert